Why it's not okay to upload someone else's mods

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

The fact that we are even discussing this is a joke.

 

1. Vaporware is not something that's in danger of disappearing. Vaporware is something that was in progress, and never saw the light of day. Examples would be: TSLRP, Malachor VI and some versions of Sleheyron. Doesn't really prove anything, but it's been annoying me.

 

2. Steam Mods are NOT WORKING. Only very basic mods (other than RCM and M478) should even work at all. This goes back to the whole "Oh, I can probably just copypasta the files from tslpatchdata into my override and it will work!" line of thought. Even if you do use the installer, the files generated oftentimes modify EXISTING files in the override. You can't upload these mods atomically to the Steam Workshop and expect them to all work in conjunction without crashes.

 

3. KotorFiles is NOT gone. GameFront is alive and well. Since these mods don't work on Steam, and GameFront is still around, THERE IS NO REASON THESE SHOULD BE UPLOADED ANYWHERE WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF THE AUTHOR SINCE THE MODS CAN STILL BE ACCESSED. Download them, save them yourself, but you don't have the right to distribute the work of other people.

 

You'll never be able to reason with pieces of crap on the internet...

 

/endrant

[Pazuzu156 6]

The way I see it, if I wanted someone to distribute or modify my work, I'd release the source code. Most of the things I do are open source, but for those that I feel should be just mine, I keep it closed, and put restrictions on them.

 

This is coming from a software guy, not so much a modder, but the same things still apply.

[Sithspecter 909]

After quite a bit of consideration, I don't think we have much to worry about, for several reasons.

 

1. The largest hosting sites that remain for KotOR modding, DeadlyStream and Nexus, haven't allowed this and will not allow it. It's still the status quo on these sites.

 

2. The moderators of /r/KotOR agree about this issue, and have graciously promised to remove any links people may post with such mods.

 

3. Steam Workshop is doomed to mangle the mods that are uploaded (at least for now), and it doesn't even exist at this point for KotOR 1. In addition, I'm sure that the Steam staff will respond positively toward any reported mods uploaded by someone who did not create them.

 

It's my thought that if someone wants to publicly upload a mod, they can try to go to Deadly Stream or Nexus. They'll get shut down. They can try to go to Reddit. They'll get shut down. They can try to go to Steam Workshop. The mod they posted will most likely not work, they'll probably get shut down. Any users who download non-working Steam Workshop mods will probably come here, and we'll steer them in the right direction.

 

I don't think this will be as big of an issue as previously thought, and will hopefully bring more members to this community, which is fine by me. I think that the unveiling of the updated TSL on Steam with the Workshop and the shutting down of KotOR Files within a week was just bad timing. I think it will all smooth out soon.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

After quite a bit of consideration, I don't think we have much to worry about, for several reasons.

 

1. The largest hosting sites that remain for KotOR modding, DeadlyStream and Nexus, haven't allowed this and will not allow it. It's still the status quo on these sites.

 

2. The moderators of /r/KotOR agree about this issue, and have graciously promised to remove any links people may post with such mods.

 

3. Steam Workshop is doomed to mangle the mods that are uploaded (at least for now), and it doesn't even exist at this point for KotOR 1. In addition, I'm sure that the Steam staff will respond positively toward any reported mods uploaded by someone who did not create them.

 

It's my thought that if someone wants to publicly upload a mod, they can try to go to Deadly Stream or Nexus. They'll get shut down. They can try to go to Reddit. They'll get shut down. They can try to go to Steam Workshop. The mod they posted will most likely not work, they'll probably get shut down. Any users who download non-working Steam Workshop mods will probably come here, and we'll steer them in the right direction.

 

I don't think this will be as big of an issue as previously thought, and will hopefully bring more members to this community, which is fine by me. I think that the unveiling of the updated TSL on Steam with the Workshop and the shutting down of KotOR Files within a week was just bad timing. I think it will all smooth out soon.

 

Sithspecter, the arbiter of reason

[SaltySoul 1]

Unless I can confirm that it is indeed the original author, I personally will refuse to download any mods. This being said, is there a general consensus now that the community is not going to use the workshop? Surely a presence on the workshop would reach more people

[DarthParametric 3,782]

The problem is that the implementation of the Workshop is fundamentally broken when it comes to KOTOR modding. I'm sure most authors would be willing to upload their mods to the Workshop if it actually worked properly.

[ChrisC26 12]

Unless I can confirm that it is indeed the original author, I personally will refuse to download any mods. This being said, is there a general consensus now that the community is not going to use the workshop? Surely a presence on the workshop would reach more people

Using the workshop is pretty much useless anyways since from last I checked, the only properly updated mod was TSLRCM (and I think M4-78)

 

People uploading mods in a way that won't work will just get taken down (albeit after time and complaints?) and people from communities such as this or LF or whatever won't download them to begin with either out of respect or knowledge or the expectation that they won't work.

 

Now... 

 

I have to disagree from the mob on this one. I dont see an issue with saving someone's work from a sinking ship such as Filefront. The argument that we shouldn't spread others work because we don't have permission from authors who havent been active since 2009 doesn't appeal to me. The people spreading these mods are fans of the mods. If we don't reupload these mods then they are lost and never used again.

I do partially agree with Peanutz and I also agree with,

 

Nonsense. If that can't get them through the Gamefront links (KOTOR, TSL), all those folks have to do if they want those mods is make a request is go to this thread and make a request.

BUT when the possibility of a mod hosting site being shut down is news right around the corner, I think mods should always be uploaded to at least two locations by the author(s) of course.

 

Under circumstances where mods are only uploaded to one location, I think we have an obligation to at least contact the author so that they can give permission or upload it themselves to "Site B" so that their work is not lost in space and so that it can be enjoyed from there on out.

 

And yes, we can always try request threads which are helpful and do work but they also aren't 100% reliable.

 

If there is a mod with an author no longer active, and we are unable to contact said author, I don't see the harm in uploading their mod under their name. And I do agree with the "what if the author returns to the modding scene?" argument, but it is sort of a double edged sword, cause what if they return and their old mods are no where to be found because they were lost in space?

[Hassat Hunter 571]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=488427853

 

Seriously, wtf Steam community? Read the comments. I want it down now more than ever so please help me by reporting the crap out of it?

[Fair Strides 509]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=488427853

 

Seriously, wtf Steam community? Read the comments. I want it down now more than ever so please help me by reporting the crap out of it?

There you go, Hassat. Commented and reported for outright theft.

 

The irony? The uploader says this:

 

"NOT MY MOD! ALL RIGHTS BELONG TO ORIGNAL OWNER. IF YOU ARE THE OWNER OF THIS CONTENT AND YOU WANT IT REMOVED PLEASE CONTACT ME."

 

But then refuses to remove it...

[Hassat Hunter 571]

Thanks... yeah, it wasn't even there yet but now I'm just even more furious with it.

 

And off-topic; Why is the KSE 3.3.6 topic on LucasForums locked?

[Fair Strides 509]

Thanks... yeah, it wasn't even there yet but now I'm just even more furious with it.

 

And off-topic; Why is the KSE 3.3.6 topic on LucasForums locked?

I have no idea...

 

I'd asked Sith Specter to change the thread name, since I'm not a moderator (though I seem to have some moderator privileges...), but that's all that should have been done...

[Kexikus 995]

I'll do the same. I wonder however why you don't want to upload your mod over on the Steam workshop? It's only one file but it's pretty popular, so I don't see why you wouldn't want to share it via workshop. It's obviously your choice and the author not taking it down for that reason is just behaving like an asshat there...

[Fair Strides 509]

I'll do the same. I wonder however why you don't want to upload your mod over on the Steam workshop? It's only one file but it's pretty popular, so I don't see why you wouldn't want to share it via workshop. It's obviously your choice and the author not taking it down for that reason is just behaving like an asshat there...

Well, my two cents and best bet would be the way they treated HH's (the AUTHOR'S) request to take the mod down since no permission was requested, granted, or even accredited. Then the uploader said, "No!"...

[DarthParametric 3,782]

The irony? The uploader says this:

 

"NOT MY MOD! ALL RIGHTS BELONG TO ORIGNAL OWNER. IF YOU ARE THE OWNER OF THIS CONTENT AND YOU WANT IT REMOVED PLEASE CONTACT ME."

 

But then refuses to remove it...

Gotta love that attitude. I reported it as well, for whatever it is worth.

 

I wonder however why you don't want to upload your mod over on the Steam workshop? It's only one file but it's pretty popular, so I don't see why you wouldn't want to share it via workshop.

There are plenty of potential reasons, not least of which is the Workshop is a poorly implemented repository for mods. But it's irrelevant. The wishes of the author should be respected, regardless of the motivation/reason.

[Kexikus 995]

Well, my two cents and best bet would be the way they treated HH's (the AUTHOR'S) request to take the mod down since no permission was requested, granted, or even accredited. Then the uploader said, "No!"...

 

I can understand that but the uploader only said "No!" after HH said he wouldn't upload it to the workshop. After this comment and all the other reactions to his decision I wouldn't upload it either (or atleast not in the near future), but I was wondering what his original reason was.

[Hassat Hunter 571]

It's all stated there... workshop got enough issues as is, and a one-file in override mod doesn't need a workshop entry. Just get it here or moddb and place it in TSLRCM's override, done. If they can't do that they're in for much worse for H4F (TSLPatcher). Not that I'm in an updating modd at the moment.

 

Also seems he deleted FS's comment aswell as another friend of me replying. What is his problem?

Thanks for reporting everyone!

[Fair Strides 509]

It's all stated there... workshop got enough issues as is, and a one-file in override mod doesn't need a workshop entry. Just get it here or moddb and place it in TSLRCM's override, done. If they can't do that they're in for much worse for H4F (TSLPatcher). Not that I'm in an updating modd at the moment.

 

Also seems he deleted FS's comment aswell as another friend of me replying. What is his problem?

Thanks for reporting everyone!

Whoa, whoa, WHAT?! *now mad*

[InSidious 237]

I've also reported it.

 

And this, folks, is why we have the rules we do about uploading mods...

[Sith Holocron 2,478]

1) Reported that mod and was glad to do it especially because . . .

2) That same "guy" - and I use that term loosely - had uploaded most of my mods.  They got taken down either because I asked Xuul to talk with him or because I said I would have them uploaded in a week from the time they were yanked down.  (Maybe you understand now why I was in a hurry to upload to that place now?)

 

3) Not a fan of Steam Workshop - not one bit - but if it takes of my friends here to upload it in order to actually get acknowledgement, so be it.

 

4) Someone tried uploading a mod that wasn't theirs here last night.  The person even admitted the mod wasn't theirs!  That attempt failed and that person was banned. 

[ZM90 100]

Ugh....this crap again...dammit Steam!!!!

[1Leonard 134]

Just posted a comment, he deleted that in half an hour. I think he also edited the disclaimer into if you want to remove it because you want to upload it yourself. What a selfish entitled person...

 

Also HH:Can't you just ban him from using your workshop entry of tslrcm?

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

What a piece of crap that guy is.

 

Hassat Hunter, I would just upload a version of the mod. Make it crash.

 

 

EDIT: Also, the continued upload of stolen mods on Steam I see is really starting to make me angry...

 

What a piece of trash community.

[1Leonard 134]

What a piece of crap that guy is.

 

Hassat Hunter, I would just upload a version of the mod. Make it crash.

 

 

EDIT: Also, the continued upload of stolen mods on Steam I see is really starting to make me angry...

 

What a piece of trash community.

It really is laziness, they want to install something in one click, not in two or three.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

It really is laziness, they want to install something in one click, not in two or three.

 

Argh, that's a good point... That's not something we can really compete with.

 

Not worth all of the extra work, to compete with a similar sort of installation here

[SaltySoul 1]

Also flagged the mod. Added the caveat of suggesting he be banned from the workshop altogether for being a repeat offender. Stupid people will be stupid.