The KOTOR 3 Collab

[John Doom 38]

😀 Let's make KOTOR 3 as a collab! In this way, we'll have more chances to cover its complexity with our numbers. There's also a twist: we have a concept we can use as a basis. This means that if any of us stops working on this mod, someone else can still take their place, because they just need to read the concept to know what to do next.

I wrote this concept over the last week, using everything Avallone said in interviews. It's still rough, but contains the whole main quest and details about the main characters. To make it easier to develop, I tried not to add too many planets and quests for now, we may still add them later.

This is a holy quest for all modders and fans, let's work together! Check the concept and let me know what you think.

concept.doc

[Canderis 180]

https://web.archive.org/web/20121204061250/http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=207884

 

Old post, but still very relevant

[John Doom 38]

Are you saying no one will ever be interested in helping make k3?

Edited August 15, 2020 by John Doom

[HarIII 19]

I'm not going lie, this has my attention. However, as Canderis pointed out, creating a story conversion mod is a massive undertaking that requires true levels of dedication. I can't tell you how many attempts at one there have been, myself being one, and to my knowledge only one managed to reach completion which was The Jedi Masters.

 

Also John Doom, I see that you are very new to the server. I've been off and on since the old Lucasforums days back in the late 2000s. The big question is, do you personally have any modding experience in the KOTOR series?

Edited August 15, 2020 by HarIII

[John Doom 38]

 Yep:

On 8/12/2020 at 8:20 PM, John Doom said:

😀 Hello there, I'm a new user, 10+ years of modding experience and some in modding KOTOR2.

If we break the project into smaller tasks, I think we can do it

[Logan23 205]

When deciding on the planets you plan to use... you should decide in part with the idea of which k2/k1 modules would you use. If you don't do that then you will have some cool concepts for planets but no existing modules that would fit the planets you wish to have in your game.

Also understand a mod like this will take a long time, the more complex you make it,.. the longer it will be.

[HarIII 19]

52 minutes ago, Logan23 said:

When deciding on the planets you plan to use... you should decide in part with the idea of which k2/k1 modules would you use. If you don't do that then you will have some cool concepts for planets but no existing modules that would fit the planets you wish to have in your game.

Also understand a mod like this will take a long time, the more complex you make it,.. the longer it will be.

So true. Its not a question of whether any of would like to see a KOTOR 3. I believe that it is reasonable to speak for everyone that if you are at all involved on Deadlystream than you by default hope to see it happen. Its just a question how conceivable it is to actually have a bunch of us to grab a beer or two, sit down, and dedicate ourselves to it.

[John Doom 38]

3 hours ago, Logan23 said:

When deciding on the planets you plan to use... you should decide in part with the idea of which k2/k1 modules would you use. If you don't do that then you will have some cool concepts for planets but no existing modules that would fit the planets you wish to have in your game.

Actually, I'm trying to make actual new modules. 🤣 Unfortunately I suck at 3d modelling, but my scripting is better, so I'm developing a tool to convert 2d maps into mdl/mdx. So far I've managed to make a simple floor and a temporary walkmesh. I'll keep working on it.

About walkmeshes, I've a serious question: after using KotorMax or my tool, and KAurora to export to mdl/mdx and wok, my module usually crashes on loading in k2. If I remove the walkmesh data from the ascii mdl and compile only the mdl/mdx, it works, though, even with the same wok file. What's going on?

test01a.ascii.mdl

Edited August 16, 2020 by John Doom

[ebmar 893]

14 hours ago, John Doom said:

Actually, I'm trying to make actual new modules.

Does remaking the existing modules may didn't work for you? Just my 2c -- I think everyone be better off remaking the existing modules rather creating new ones, at least with resources/SDK that we had for now. I mean, modules not only about models and textures -- there are also lightmaps, paths [in PTH format if I recall correctly] and many other details that's close to impossible not seeing the day-light to create from scratch -- that if the goals actually to make them functioning in real-time, rather than only for display/proof of concept.

Take this one for example. That's a reskin of RedHawke's ORD Mandell Mod. From what I see, it looks decent enough for a new planet, without having the feeling like it's a straight copy-paste to Dreshdae. Another outstanding example is this one by @Sithspecter [excuse me for using your post as a reference, SS] --

Spoiler

-- if I haven't told that it was a reskin of Manaan's Sea Floor - I wouldn't have guessed, really.

Edit: another great example of reusing modules is @jc2's Lehon Mandalorian Expansion. He's remaking the Rakatan settlement as the Mandalorian stronghold in his mod. Though aesthetically look the same, other than that everything looks different with smart replacement of NPCs and placeables. Though locally I did modded the looks of the module, so it looked like this --

Spoiler

-- and that's only changing the skyboxes and the flag's texture. Not yet involved with lightmaps, AuroraLight and fog.

TL;DR -- there are much more important things rather than fiddling and getting burned out with newly created areas/modules; such as gameplay, storyline, characters/NPCs, voice-overs and audio [BGM, SFX] are elements that can make a reused modules feels unique and fun to be play with. I mean, big name developers are also known for reusing their assets far as I'm concerned, hahah.

Edit2: what I'm trying to say above was -- it's not entirely impossible, only it's a pain to do so. At this point we may have to reflect at Canderis' post above. Also I seemed to forgot that you were talking about doing a "KotOR III" -- I thought it was about new modules, even more a new planet that already send chills down my spine, hahah.

I hope that can be useful -- since you asked for feedbacks.

P.S. hope that I can contribute more on this one, but since I haven't finished TSL yet think I'm stuck at technical areas for now, lol.

Edited August 17, 2020 by ebmar
Added Edit2

[John Doom 38]

I guess you're right, I'll have to reskin modules... but I'd rather not to: when I played The Jedi Masters, I found every reskinned module to be too distracting. Of course I understand we don't have a complete toolset to work on modules, but I think it's very important to find a way to get this right. I don't want to be too ambitious, so I think I'll give doing a module from scratch another chance and, if I find it to be impossible, I'll take your suggestion and just reskin modules.

So far, I've been able to use simple meshes and .3ds objects in a module. I think paths could be added with a bit of work, lightmaps I'm not sure. My current problem is camera collision is missing and I don't know how to set it, I can't find one tutorial on this

UPDATE: I've been able to fix the camera issue and the bugs I mentioned before. First of all, i ditched kaurora for mdlops, then I tried merging the walkmesh with a box representing the wall and it worked! 😀

Edited August 18, 2020 by John Doom

[Logan23 205]

With textures for reskinning - its best to take existing ones and edit them,.. cut and paste a few together along with tweak to its color,..etc.... 

[Jorak Uln 458]

 

 

On 8/17/2020 at 1:25 AM, John Doom said:

Actually, I'm trying to make actual new modules. 🤣 Unfortunately I suck at 3d modelling, but my scripting is better, so I'm developing a tool to convert 2d maps into mdl/mdx. So far I've managed to make a simple floor and a temporary walkmesh. I'll keep working on it.

About walkmeshes, I've a serious question: after using KotorMax or my tool, and KAurora to export to mdl/mdx and wok, my module usually crashes on loading in k2. If I remove the walkmesh data from the ascii mdl and compile only the mdl/mdx, it works, though, even with the same wok file. 

About walkmeshes etc. you should ask Darth Parametric. Hes the expert regarding all 3d modeling stuff here.

Btw. i like your idea creating a K3 very much, in fact ive been waiting for this to happen since a long time.

But since im working on a mammoth sized texture recreation project myself i know that time is an important factor and if you can make things easier (without sacrificing quality), why not?

Here some suggestions for your project:

What do you think about making the whole thing not as standalone, but as addin /DLC for K2 instead?

It would make Kotor2 campaign feel fresh again and has further advantages:

1. you are much more flexible regarding the overall size/time you invest into your project.

2. the K3 campaign story assets are accessible already: 

Remember that Kreia on Malachor said that Revan went to the unknown regions to search for the true sith?

What if you move this dialogue to Dantooine, where Kreia killed the 3 Jedi Masters? If you let an enraged exile fight & lose to Kreia afterwards, with Kreia disappearing after the fight, this gives you the opportunity to start your Mod seamlessly in the campaign:

Remember the Navicomputer on the Hawk? 

With Kreia vanished the Exile decides to follow Revan to help eliminating the threat of the true sith,  T3 hacks the navicomputer and founds 2 destinations:

Lehon & Starforge.

Now, the cool thing is - if you like the idea - these 2 planets are already integrated & fully playable in the Kotor 2 campaign (mod ressource by Thor110).

So, if you start the mod this way,  you have 2 bonus planets intgrated already plus you can add a third planet (btw. Sleheyron is also intgrated to K2 by Thor110)...

This way  you can basically start your mod from the "halfway" line & dont have to make everything from scratch...

What do you think?

[John Doom 38]

Thanks for your support and suggestion. I like your idea, it's brilliant and well thought, but I can't do that, because my goal is to make an actual new game in the series. I'm sorry to disappoint you.

About making new modules, I've figured how to add a skybox and I'm now studying how to implement lightmaps (I think I'll have to make a proper tutorial sooner or later 🤣).

[Logan23 205]

I would suggest you take an existing module and repopulate it and place a demo quest inside it to help you gauge how long it will take you to build content. This means having dlg with scripts that do checks on jrl entries , etc. 
This will help you see how involved it can be to build a mod this size.

This can also help you figure out how long/ large you want this mod to be.

Keep things as simple as possible with scripting or you could place yourself in a spot where you wrote something cool for a level or quest but the scripting might not transfer as easily to this idea you have.

[John Doom 38]

I couldn't get lightmaps to work yet, but I've at least managed to apply sunlight. Here's a new module's prototype: on the right is the cantina, small and reassuring; opposing the exile is the sith palace, watching over the whole walled sector. Making prototypes is easy and you can focus on quick edits. I won't probably work on making them look good until the rest of the project is complete, so time isn't wasted on details.

Besides, now that I've figured how to model new modules, I can say it isn't too difficult. I'm probably going to make a tutorial sooner or later, so everyone can learn how to do it.

@Logan23 don't worry, I studied this project for a whole week, I put only what is strictly necessary in terms of quests and modules. My goal is to prototype everything to get as fast as possible to a playable beta, then it will be only a matter of polishing.

[Logan23 205]

Good to hear 😃

[Todd Hellid 16]

Please make the graphics and movies in higher quality than The Jedi Masters Mod.

[Kexikus 995]

Since you're creating area models (although I'm not quite sure which software you're using and I don't think you'll get around actual 3d modeling if you want to continue this project), here's two threads that you should look at that contain pretty much all the information needed to create custom areas which is totally possible even though it's obviously a lot of work:

And finally, here's a tutorial on lightmaps:

 

[John Doom 38]

😀 Many thanks @Kexikus, this is exactly what I was looking for!

11 hours ago, Todd Hellid said:

Please make the graphics and movies in higher quality than The Jedi Masters Mod.

Hopefully we'll get to this as well, especially with help from the community 🙂

[John Doom 38]

😀 Prototype modules for the 1st planet are complete, I'm now working on programming its quest!

[John Doom 38]

"Time to take you down to size"

[Logan23 205]

Will you be taking in consideration to the different k1 and k2 endings,... since atton could be dead as well as other characters

[John Doom 38]

@Logan23 I haven't thought about it. Atton in k2's ending was so cool I just couldn't think of removing him from k3. I guess I should find a way to make him optional though, you're right

[John Doom 38]

About 50% of the 1st planet is now playable (very rough, though xd).

[John Doom 38]

Zlaya's prototype is complete, which means about 1/5th of the entire game is already playable. I'm going to add a few fixes than I'll move forward to the next planet. In the meantime I'd like you to help me by polishing Zlaya, especially with dialogues, cutscenes and bug fixes: I'll tell you more in my next update.

P.S.: Mira is actually a temporary Yatalia 🙃