Who Ordered the Attack on Telos?

[105491689125 3]

I agree. Also, Tobin says that there are "hundreds of Jedi" for Nihilis(sp?) to feed on in the academy at Telos, but it makes no sense that he wouldn't already know that's wrong, since he felt the gathering of what few Jedi were left on Katarr. So some explanation for that would be nice, if it exists.

 

Remember that Nihilus obviously wasn't at Telos when Tobin told him about the alleged jedi academy there. So he could hardly have sensed it. And even at Telos, he might be doubtful, since Telos was only supposed to have an academy of presumably students with limited strength in the Force, whereas the gathering on Katarr was one of jedi masters as well as an entire planet full of force sensitive Miraluka.

[bendarby24 24]

He couldn't sense the Jedi on Telos because it was a place where a echo took place - like Dantooine and Nar Shaddaa. When Revan attacked Telos, it created a echo in the force like all the other worlds ... that why he couldn't sense them!

[Mandalore 61]

That and the fact that there's only one Jedi there (Atris), all others are blind to the Force...

[Sith Holocron 2,478]

He couldn't sense the Jedi on Telos because it was a place where a echo took place - like Dantooine and Nar Shaddaa. When Revan attacked Telos, it created a echo in the force like all the other worlds ... that why he couldn't sense them!

 

Darth Malak was the one that actually attacked Telos but other than that, your theory is sound.

[bendarby24 24]

Darth Malak was the one that actually attacked Telos but other than that, your theory is sound.

Wait . . . I thought Kreia said to you it was the first place Revan attacked because it was a retreat for the Jedi? Also at this time, Revan was still in command of the Sith empire.

[Sith Holocron 2,478]

I know which error you speak of. However, Canderous Ordo himself says to Carth the following in the first game: "Everyone knows it was Malak who gave the order to attack your people, Carth. You can't blame Revan for that."

 

Yes, I know he contradicts himself in TSL when he says "These are the remains of Telos. Admiral Saul Karath bombed it into oblivion during the war. Seemed like an odd target, not many defenses or troops worth fighting but maybe that's why Revan chose it." I believe I can splice that line to correct lay the blame back at Malak's feet if folks would like it to be canonically correct. I spliced another consistency on this matter before with a different character - it was either Atris or Kreia.

[Hassat Hunter 571]

He could be just lying in KOTOR1, you know. Or the truth was concealed. Definitely the trade-mark of a student of Kreia.

 

After all, it does explain the HK-Factory being there ("maybe Revan left other secrets beneath it's surface"). Which wouldn't be explained by "just making it Malak"...

 

And as Scorchy already said, "Revan is the source of everything in this game"...

[Sith Holocron 2,478]

Canderous Ordo only says that line after the player is revealed as Revan. Canderous was only interested in defending Revan at that point. Note that Carth doesn't dispute Canderous on who bombed Telos either. Revan may have lied about things but that information never comes directly from him. Hell, he doesn't even have all of his memories back at that point.

 

Revan is behind everything in this game but using HK-50 droids would be too subtle a move for Malak but even an idiot like him would destroy something that could sent after him. Malak engaged warfare like wielding an club. according to HK-47. (I'm paraphrasing.)

 

Pretty sneaky using Scorchy against me. LOL

[bendarby24 24]

My theory is that Revan planned to attack there, but Darth Malak and Admiral Saul Karath were the ones attacked. That kind of make sense for both theories.

[105491689125 3]

Who can tell who really ordered the attack on Telos. Canderous might have said what he did, because he simply didn't know any better. The same can be true for Kreia, since she apparently had no contact with Revan during the Jedi Civil War. More likely she assumes targeting Telos was Revan's choice, because it plays to her sense of strategy, which she would probably not associate with Malak.

 

On the other hand, while Kreia's line that Revan attacked Telos did not appear in vanilla TSL, I would have interpreted it as a retcon or revelation (or both) if it had. Canderous may say everyone knew Malak ordered the attack on Telos, but how do we know Revan wasn't involved in that choice? Revan was Malak's master at the time, after all.

 

I do think it's fair to say neither Revan nor Malak took part in the attack on Telos, though. It was carried out by Saul Karath. Because if it wasn't, then the plot of KotOR1 falls apart - the bombing of Telos is precisely the thing that Carth blames Karath for doing. If you mess with that, that plot thread begins to unravel.

 

In fact, I could imagine the following scenario taking place: Revan is aware of the "back-up" academy on Telos, so he tells Malak that the jedi are cowardly building an academy on Telos to retreat to if things get rough. Revan then adds that they should probably attack this place some time to make the point to the jedi that there will be no place to hide from Revan's Sith Empire (this is the point Kreia makes in the cut VO). Malak remembers this, when he is uncertain of Saul Karath's loyalty to the Sith, so he orders him to take a fleet to Telos and bomb it as a demonstration of his dedication.

[Rtas Vadum 17]

Who can tell who really ordered the attack on Telos. Canderous might have said what he did, because he simply didn't know any better. The same can be true for Kreia, since she apparently had no contact with Revan during the Jedi Civil War. More likely she assumes targeting Telos was Revan's choice, because it plays to her sense of strategy, which she would probably not associate with Malak.

 

On the other hand, while Kreia's line that Revan attacked Telos did not appear in vanilla TSL, I would have interpreted it as a retcon or revelation (or both) if it had. Canderous may say everyone knew Malak ordered the attack on Telos, but how do we know Revan wasn't involved in that choice? Revan was Malak's master at the time, after all.

 

I do think it's fair to say neither Revan nor Malak took part in the attack on Telos, though. It was carried out by Saul Karath. Because if it wasn't, then the plot of KotOR1 falls apart - the bombing of Telos is precisely the thing that Carth blames Karath for doing. If you mess with that, that plot thread begins to unravel.

 

In fact, I could imagine the following scenario taking place: Revan is aware of the "back-up" academy on Telos, so he tells Malak that the jedi are cowardly building an academy on Telos to retreat to if things get rough. Revan then adds that they should probably attack this place some time to make the point to the jedi that there will be no place to hide from Revan's Sith Empire (this is the point Kreia makes in the cut VO). Malak remembers this, when he is uncertain of Saul Karath's loyalty to the Sith, so he orders him to take a fleet to Telos and bomb it as a demonstration of his dedication.

 

It's likely a few things. But first the obvious, as Revan would've cared more about the hidden Jedi Academy on Telos, rather than any other settlements/cities there. Although it is curious that the Academy itself seems untouched, that is likely because of who actually carried out the attack. I can't say who might assigned Karath to it, or gave him the order, but it's likely that he would've considered anything but a snowy, unassuming plateau(if that is what it was at that point), as a threat. So it probably boils down to Revan giving either Saul or Malak the target, and not specifically why they were going to attack it, or the orders were interpreted wrongly. Although, the message Revan might've intended(That there would be nowhere for the Jedi to hide), seems to have gotten across, at least until the time of this game.

[bendarby24 24]

No, I think the academy was not built then - but it was always the Jedi plan to retreat to Telos if the Jedi temple on Coruscant was destroyed.

[HK-47 84]

I do think it's fair to say neither Revan nor Malak took part in the attack on Telos, though. It was carried out by Saul Karath. Because if it wasn't, then the plot of KotOR1 falls apart - the bombing of Telos is precisely the thing that Carth blames Karath for doing. If you mess with that, that plot thread begins to unravel.

 

In fact, I could imagine the following scenario taking place: Revan is aware of the "back-up" academy on Telos, so he tells Malak that the jedi are cowardly building an academy on Telos to retreat to if things get rough. Revan then adds that they should probably attack this place some time to make the point to the jedi that there will be no place to hide from Revan's Sith Empire (this is the point Kreia makes in the cut VO). Malak remembers this, when he is uncertain of Saul Karath's loyalty to the Sith, so he orders him to take a fleet to Telos and bomb it as a demonstration of his dedication.

 

Statement: It was Malak that gave the order. Having Canderous say that doesn't break anything.

[bendarby24 24]

OK . . . Darth Malak did give the order (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Telos_IV) but I still think it was Revan's plan because Malak is not as tactical as Darth Revan!

[105491689125 3]

No, I think the academy was not built then - but it was always the Jedi plan to retreat to Telos if the Jedi temple on Corusoant was destroyed.

 

Well, who would have built it later given that it was known only to the Jedi? And with what resources?

 

But otherwise I agree - Malak gave the order, but it was probably Revan's idea.

[bendarby24 24]

OK, the politics will need to wait until anogher time. Let's get back to TSLRCM 1.8.

 

If you want to keep discussing (or as I call it "fighting") we could make another thread to house this in. I will be ready to "fight it out" after Monday because I have my last exam that day

[bendarby24 24]

Sorry for the quote marks- I could'nt get it working and I was in a rush If you can Sith Holocron, can you get them working?

 

[Fixed ~SH]

 

He bombarded Taris to try and kill Revan, did he not?

 

First of all, he didn't know Revan was on Taris. He did it because he did not want Bastila escaping the planet.

 

Had he been aware of a Jedi refuge on Telos?

 

Secondly, there was no Jedi refuge on Telos except for the ones who had failed there training and were sent there to become farmers. This is why Kreia said you might find a master to help you on Telos but they are Jedi no longer.

 

As on Katarr, there's no reason why Revan would have to have been the one to order it.

 

This had nothing to do with Malak or Revan. It is a totally different topic.

 

I don't know why you are talking about a different world than Telos. I was only saying that he gave the order for Telos because the Jedi had planned that as a retreat for Revan.

 

....anyway I did say that if you want to continue this, that you should make another thread and I will discuss with you after Monday!

[Darth Hayze 19]

I always thought it was simply this: Revan ordered Malak to destroy Telos. Because Malak would have been the one to lead a fleet there, and give the order to fire, (and being Malak he'd have probably made some grandiose announcement about it), everyone would have made the assumption that Malak ordered the attack.

 

Kreia knew Revan's personality, and given what she knows of Telos, it is reasonable to assume she knows what she's talking about here.

 

And about Canderous, in K1 he may have actually thought Malak was responsible, by the time K2 roles along he has spent a good deal of time in Revan 's company, and with Revan remembering things, who knows what he learned.

[kyrie 17]

Here is something to think about wasn't Revan the 1 who built the HK factory on Telos? Why would he order the planet to be bombed that he built his assassin droid facility on?

[Darth Hayze 19]

To hide it!

[bendarby24 24]

He made it afterwards.

[kyrie 17]

Wasn't it built before KOTOR1?

[Ferc Kast 42]

I found the following quote on the bombing of Telos IV. It seems to settle the question of who ordered it.

 

"After the treachery of former Jedi Knights Revan and Malak, who left the Jedi to become Sith Lords, was revealed in 3,959 BBY, the former Republic Admiral Saul Karath, as a token of his loyalty, provided the Sith with the Republic Navy's docking bay codes, which enabled Sith bombers to bypass security scanners and destroy over half of the Republic fleet docked on the planet. As a reward, the new Dark Lord of the Sith, Darth Revan, promoted Karath to Supreme Commander of the Sith starfleet. As a final test of Karath's loyalty, Darth Malak, without his master Revan's approval, ordered the Admiral to bombard Telos's surface in 3,960 BBY." -Wookieepedia

[hkmandalore47 3]

from wookieepedia:

 

"After the treachery of former Jedi Knights Revan and Malak, who left the Jedi to become Sith Lords, was revealed in 3,959 BBY, the former Republic Admiral Saul Karath, as a token of his loyalty, provided the Sith with the Republic Navy's docking bay codes, which enabled Sith bombers to bypass security scanners and destroy over half of the Republic fleet docked on the planet. As a reward, the new Dark Lord of the Sith, Darth Revan, promoted Karath to Supreme Commander of the Sith starfleet.[12] As a final test of Karath's loyalty, Darth Malak, without his master Revan's approval, ordered the Admiral to bombard Telos's surface in 3,960 BBY.[11][13]"

[Darth Hayze 19]

Well, idk. Canderous and Kreia disagree, but whatever.