TSLRCM's take on Bao-Dur's endgame fate?

[Sith Holocron 2,472]

OK.  There are interesting things in this thread that should probably be explored in separate threads.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

Nah, I think we've answered the question. TSLRCM's take on Bao-Dur's fate is that it's Varsity Puppet's problem.

Is it now?

 

Excellent, I've decided that he will be killed by walking over an awkwardly placed landmine on the Ravager after defeating Nihilus.

 

You know, the same one that Canderous survives

[Lawkmt3 17]

That is so utterly wrong. LOL In all this stuff... is there a reason Bao-Dur must die? I mean what is the point of making all of them Jedi or Sith if half of them get bumped off?

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

That is so utterly wrong. LOL In all this stuff... is there a reason Bao-Dur must die? I mean what is the point of making all of them Jedi or Sith if half of them get bumped off?

Is there a reason he has to live?

[Lawkmt3 17]

Yeah, PC has to do all that work gaining influence, Jedi training, and then listen to Kreia babble how she doesn't know his path he should live.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

Yeah, PC has to do all that work gaining influence, Jedi training, and then listen to Kreia babble how she doesn't know his path he should live.

By that same logic the game shouldn't end because you put a lot of work into playing it.

 

There's literally no content for Bao-Dur in the end-game. The easiest and most commonly accepted solution is that he dies (based on the little evidence we have).

 

Of course, there's nothing forcing you to download a mod where Bao-Dur dies. Also, no one is banned from making a mod where Bao-Dur lives.

[Lawkmt3 17]

Joke it just a joke.

[Cirosan 12]

Get this guy a medal. He has just figured out a satisfying way to solve Bao-Dur's fate. Oh, and also someone should start working on a mod based on his ideas.

If that ever were to happen, I volunteer to help on such a mod. I'm primarily a Fallout modder (FO4 and FNV) but I dabbled with Kotor Tool many years ago and know how to perform basic tasks with it; I'm also familiar with TLK files and basic DLG editing. I'd probably need to de-rust, so it's not much, but better than nothing.

 

However, there seem to be a lot of ideas and a lot of mods that were put on hiatus indefinitely, so if there's a better mod or a better idea out there, I defer to it.

 

If the issue is legitimacy - as in, what the devs would have wanted vs. what some whacko on the internet came up with - I could see what I could do about that.

[Fair Strides 509]

If that ever were to happen, I volunteer to help on such a mod. I'm primarily a Fallout modder (FO4 and FNV) but I dabbled with Kotor Tool many years ago and know how to perform basic tasks with it; I'm also familiar with TLK files and basic DLG editing. I'd probably need to de-rust, so it's not much, but better than nothing.

 

However, there seem to be a lot of ideas and a lot of mods that were put on hiatus indefinitely, so if there's a better mod or a better idea out there, I defer to it.

 

If the issue is legitimacy - as in, what the devs would have wanted vs. what some whacko on the internet came up with - I could see what I could do about that.

I'm positive I could help knock the rust off of those old gears. I'd even be willing to do a fair share of the work on the mod.

[Guest]

If that ever were to happen, I volunteer to help on such a mod. I'm primarily a Fallout modder (FO4 and FNV) but I dabbled with Kotor Tool many years ago and know how to perform basic tasks with it; I'm also familiar with TLK files and basic DLG editing. I'd probably need to de-rust, so it's not much, but better than nothing.

 

However, there seem to be a lot of ideas and a lot of mods that were put on hiatus indefinitely, so if there's a better mod or a better idea out there, I defer to it.

 

If the issue is legitimacy - as in, what the devs would have wanted vs. what some whacko on the internet came up with - I could see what I could do about that.

 

I'm positive I could help knock the rust off of those old gears. I'd even be willing to do a fair share of the work on the mod.

 

 

Please! Want this to happen badly. 

[N-DReW25 1,320]

I can't spell his last name. What I meant by deadlines not interfering with story I meant writing the plot, and the characters. Not building the game itself. Mr. A. had a great theme, sound characterization, and great conflict, but he didn't WRITE the story properly. I'm a writer, it's what I do, so my issues have nothing to do with the "game" part. (I also wasn't putting down m4-78) a good writer usally knows two things, from the start... 1. What they want to say 2. How the story will end. In this case, Mr. MCA had something to say, and amazing characters to say it, however, he utterly and completely failed to make it matter to the player. In the end nothing happens! Kreia wants to cause the death of the Force without killing the Galaxy, he never explained how that may be possible. You are supposed to be a Zombie untouched by the Force, yet you weild it. Again not possible in the SW's mythos. You can be blocked, but never without it. He didn't make that clear. Characters like Bao-Dur, who do nothing after training them to be Jedi, when they should be moving along with the character. These are mistakes by an author, not "game" mistakes. 

I feel like mentioning Peragus didn't make a lot of sense. Think about it, The Restoration of Telos was a Government funded project that can an impact on the Galactic Senate if it succeeds or fails (All of this was mentioned in game). So if taxpayer money was being put into such a project that was so important why would they use highly explosive fuel that blew a chunk out of a planet when people tried to mine it. Not to mention the Citadel somehow survives a space battle, Seriously being realistic one trigger happy sith fighter could take out Citadel with a stray missile if it's loaded with explosive fuel. (Not to mention the Citadel houses many important and innocent people so imagine the Citadel getting destroyed all thanks to its only fuel source)

 

 Also, how did the Miners actually build the facility? From what we know that asteroid that the facility was on definitely had lots of fuel so how could they build a mining facility in an asteroid field in space without blowing the entire asteroid field up! If a blaster can make a big explosion I'm sure building equipment can! Also, how did no asteroids hit the actual facility AT ALL! If anything a rogue asteroid would crash into the command console room and ruin everything!

 

If I could I'd cut Peragus and move most of the Peragus stuff to M4-78 for example mining droids gone evil makes a lot of sense there and I'd start the game on Citadel where Atton and Kreia would be and you'd start the game there!

 

BACK ON TOPIC:

I feel like maybe having HK and Bao Dur spawn on the landing pad outside the Complex to see a boss either a Tank Droid or a Terentatek or better yet a big Rancor is blocking the Path which makes Bao Dur say "Make my Sacrifice Matter" then he runs up to the boss and sets his arm to explode like a power conduct killing the two in the process allowing HK to proceed into the facility (Or better yet, have Bao set his arm to explode then have him be eaten by the Rancor only to be exploded from within)

 

Or you could be lazy and force him to stay on Citadel afterward and tell him to rebuild Telos and make it a sanctuary for the Jedi or Sith depending on alignment!

[Kexikus 994]

No, no, I'm still resisting the urge. And even if I weren't I'd like to see it with his commentary first anyway, rather than try to guess at what it was supposed to be from half-finished files. Already have too much of that problem going around.

 

Same for me here

 

I'm positive I could help knock the rust off of those old gears. I'd even be willing to do a fair share of the work on the mod.

 

Oh you should never have said that xD

That said, I'd be willing to do the same...

[Cirosan 12]

I appreciate all the support; it's very encouraging. Frankly, I'm not sure where to start, but after some thinking I would like to slightly revise the T3 portion of my proposal:

 

So the whole thing falls apart for a player that never fixed HK. For them, they've got a full, unrepaired droid in the cargo bay - why bother using Bao-Dur's arm when they can just salvage an unrepaired HK for parts?

 

 

In response, I offer the following revisions, which should make things more tense:

 

In the cinematics, Malachor's center, the one the Ebon Hawk is falling into, is consumed by a bright green light. I don't think it's a leap to say this could be radiation. So, in the T3 sequence, have a computerized voice (community voice-acted) announce periodically: "Radiation levels rising." T3 is now working against the clock.

 

Scratch the party having taken absolutely everything; that was a bit of a stretch. Instead, have there be plenty of containers with parts - but they're "Irradiated Parts" (no new art assets required; use the same icon). First time the player opens a container with one, have a dialogue open that explains, "[The core of Malachor V emits dangerous radiation that greatly harms both organics and machines. These parts have been rendered inoperable by Malachor's radiation - it is only a matter of time before the Ebon Hawk itself suffers the same fate.]" More containers litter the Ebon Hawk, all of them containing Irradiated Parts. T3 and the player become increasingly desperate as they find nothing but useless, irradiated parts no matter where they look, as the computerized voice continues to blare that the radiation levels of the Ebon Hawk are rising. Eventually they realize it was all a red herring and check Bao-Dur's arm in the Med Bay, resulting in another dialogue: "[bao-Dur's superior engineering has insulated his mechanical arm from Malachor's radiation. If you wish it, the component parts of Bao-Dur's arm could be harvested to repair the hyperdrive and save the Ebon Hawk.]" Same as before, T3 is hesitant, etc.

 

If the player never repaired HK:

HK is still in the cargo annex where Mira hangs out, except he's gone from a standing to a fallen position. T3 can examine him, resulting in another mini-dialogue: "[The repairs on HK-47 were never finished, so he had no protection against Malachor's devastating radiation. Your sensors detect that he has been fully consumed by the radiation and is totally inoperable. Not even his component parts will be of use to you.]"

 

Thematically, this also reinforces just how toxic Malachor V is - how it harms and destroys everything it touches. We've seen the harm it did to the Exile, Bao-Dur, and Mandalore - now we see the harm it can do to machines, things that aren't even alive in the same way. It reinforces the game's statement that Malachor just harms and consumes - and it doesn't even care if its prey is technically alive.

 

 

So that should solve that oversight and make the T3 section more tense. My only concern is that players might not figure out to go for Bao-Dur's arm, and they might spend so long searching it'll go from tense to annoying. I'll have to think on a way to hint the player towards Bao-Dur if they start taking too long.

 

All of this, of course, assumes that this revision is an improvement. If the original, simpler idea was better, don't hesitate to say so.

[Lawkmt3 17]

If you're all really planning a mod, can we have an option where Bao-Dur gets hurt bad but if you leave him at Citidel he'll live.

[bead-v 251]

If you're all really planning a mod, can we have an option where Bao-Dur gets hurt bad but if you leave him at Citidel he'll live.

 

Honestly, I think whatever the way is he dies in, you're gonna have to pretend he somehow survived that. But you said you're good at this so

[Lawkmt3 17]

Honestly there is so much that happens in TSL that no matter what choice you make Light Dark or Neutral that doesn't mean anything in the endgame. For Example, if you're playing FemExile Atton and Mical will fight over you (yuck) if your Male Brianna acts like a spoiled rotten baby over Visas even if you don't romance Visas (double yuck) You can't save any Jedi Master no matter what etc... That as a player I just want the option of saving or killing my party members! It could be worse I could be one of the many players who think Bao-Dur should have been a romance option.  

[Domino5555 119]

I appreciate all the support; it's very encouraging. Frankly, I'm not sure where to start, but after some thinking I would like to slightly revise the T3 portion of my proposal:

 

So the whole thing falls apart for a player that never fixed HK. For them, they've got a full, unrepaired droid in the cargo bay - why bother using Bao-Dur's arm when they can just salvage an unrepaired HK for parts?

 

 

In response, I offer the following revisions, which should make things more tense:

 

In the cinematics, Malachor's center, the one the Ebon Hawk is falling into, is consumed by a bright green light. I don't think it's a leap to say this could be radiation. So, in the T3 sequence, have a computerized voice (community voice-acted) announce periodically: "Radiation levels rising." T3 is now working against the clock.

 

Scratch the party having taken absolutely everything; that was a bit of a stretch. Instead, have there be plenty of containers with parts - but they're "Irradiated Parts" (no new art assets required; use the same icon). First time the player opens a container with one, have a dialogue open that explains, "[The core of Malachor V emits dangerous radiation that greatly harms both organics and machines. These parts have been rendered inoperable by Malachor's radiation - it is only a matter of time before the Ebon Hawk itself suffers the same fate.]" More containers litter the Ebon Hawk, all of them containing Irradiated Parts. T3 and the player become increasingly desperate as they find nothing but useless, irradiated parts no matter where they look, as the computerized voice continues to blare that the radiation levels of the Ebon Hawk are rising. Eventually they realize it was all a red herring and check Bao-Dur's arm in the Med Bay, resulting in another dialogue: "[bao-Dur's superior engineering has insulated his mechanical arm from Malachor's radiation. If you wish it, the component parts of Bao-Dur's arm could be harvested to repair the hyperdrive and save the Ebon Hawk.]" Same as before, T3 is hesitant, etc.

 

If the player never repaired HK:

HK is still in the cargo annex where Mira hangs out, except he's gone from a standing to a fallen position. T3 can examine him, resulting in another mini-dialogue: "[The repairs on HK-47 were never finished, so he had no protection against Malachor's devastating radiation. Your sensors detect that he has been fully consumed by the radiation and is totally inoperable. Not even his component parts will be of use to you.]"

 

Thematically, this also reinforces just how toxic Malachor V is - how it harms and destroys everything it touches. We've seen the harm it did to the Exile, Bao-Dur, and Mandalore - now we see the harm it can do to machines, things that aren't even alive in the same way. It reinforces the game's statement that Malachor just harms and consumes - and it doesn't even care if its prey is technically alive.

 

 

So that should solve that oversight and make the T3 section more tense. My only concern is that players might not figure out to go for Bao-Dur's arm, and they might spend so long searching it'll go from tense to annoying. I'll have to think on a way to hint the player towards Bao-Dur if they start taking too long.

 

All of this, of course, assumes that this revision is an improvement. If the original, simpler idea was better, don't hesitate to say so.

Excellent idea, except for the part where T3 is apparently still intact.

[Cirosan 12]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't T3 implied to still be alive? Kreia says at the end that "the small one [droid] who waits outside has one last mission for you" and since it can't be Goto, HK, or the Remote because they all have their own standoff, it has to be him. Also, he's an available party member for the Attack on Telos, isn't he?

 

 

Either way, it's probably time to start asking some more serious questions regarding this proposal. Three in particular.

 

1. Fair Strides and Kexikus have volunteered to help, if I understand correctly. Is there anyone else who wishes to help?

 

2. Are there any further objections to the proposals I've outlined in this thread? (proposals found here and here)

 

3. This one I defer to our volunteers and people uninvolved with the mod but who have worked on similar projects: How do we get started?

[Sith Holocron 2,472]

How do we get started?

Create a WIP thread so I can lock this one.

BTW, I recommend changing your radiation idea to "corruption" as it's non specific and not covering stuff already done in M4-78.

 

/sarcasm
Because everyone loved the radiation mission.
/endsarcasm

[Fair Strides 509]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't T3 implied to still be alive? Kreia says at the end that "the small one [droid] who waits outside has one last mission for you" and since it can't be Goto, HK, or the Remote because they all have their own standoff, it has to be him. Also, he's an available party member for the Attack on Telos, isn't he?

 

 

Either way, it's probably time to start asking some more serious questions regarding this proposal. Three in particular.

 

1. Fair Strides and Kexikus have volunteered to help, if I understand correctly. Is there anyone else who wishes to help?

 

2. Are there any further objections to the proposals I've outlined in this thread? (proposals found here and here)

 

3. This one I defer to our volunteers and people uninvolved with the mod but who have worked on similar projects: How do we get started?

 

You hold onto the PM I'm sending to you and Kexikus, we create a WIP thread using a condensed (think bullet-points) write-up of the ideas and general order, and then we decide via PM on a time when we can all get together to discuss the materials and where to begin, as well as who would be doing what to begin with.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't T3 implied to still be alive? Kreia says at the end that "the small one [droid] who waits outside has one last mission for you" and since it can't be Goto, HK, or the Remote because they all have their own standoff, it has to be him. Also, he's an available party member for the Attack on Telos, isn't he?

 

 

Either way, it's probably time to start asking some more serious questions regarding this proposal. Three in particular.

 

1. Fair Strides and Kexikus have volunteered to help, if I understand correctly. Is there anyone else who wishes to help?

 

2. Are there any further objections to the proposals I've outlined in this thread? (proposals found here and here)

 

3. This one I defer to our volunteers and people uninvolved with the mod but who have worked on similar projects: How do we get started?

Unless it's specifically Bead's idea for Bao-Dur's fate, I object entirely, but don't let me stop you from making this mod

[Malkior 476]

For what it's worth, I like the idea of giving Bao a better end but disagree on making T3 save the Ebon Hawk (again) as well as using Bao'arm as a sort of "chekov's gun" in that it both seems unrealistic in terms of Star Wars tech (servos can't fix interstellar components due to their size and physical structure), but also in terms of him dying for the sake of the plot rather than his clearly premeditated sacrifice (allegedly) from the original story.

[Guest]

For what it's worth, I like the idea of giving Bao a better end but disagree on making T3 save the Ebon Hawk (again) as well as using Bao'arm as a sort of "chekov's gun" in that it both seems unrealistic in terms of Star Wars tech (servos can't fix interstellar components due to their size and physical structure), but also in terms of him dying for the sake of the plot rather than his clearly premeditated sacrifice (allegedly) from the original story.

 

I agree with this apart from T3-M4 saving the Hawk, I think that would be a neat parallel to the beginning of the game. 

[Cirosan 12]

I do have replies to your critiques, but I don't think this thread is the place for it anymore. I've made a thread in the WIP forum for the proposals, which is now officially the Bao-Dur Endgame Enhancement. The thread can be found here.

 

Besides that, I welcome your critiques and look forward to engaging with the community to make the best mod possible.

[Sith Holocron 2,472]

Locked.