Questions about the future of Kotor/TSL Modding

[Hobbes 1]

Hello, Deadly Stream Community!

 

Just recently I was thinking about the KOTOR and TSL and the state of modding for these games. However, before I get into that let my introduce myself. I first heard about modding video games though the KOTOR series when I was eight years old.

 

My first two mods I installed for the game were the amazing Holowan plugin and the equally awesome All In One Force Powers mod. Now looking back I don't even think these two mods were compatible with each over lol {This was before the TSL Patcher tool was released.} I visited the Holowan Labs back then pretty much every day to see what kind of mods people were making for KOTOR and TSL. Playing mods for these games was one of the best experiences in my life. I am really glad to see that after all these years there is still Interest in KOTOR and TSL. Thank you deadlystream.com for keeping these games and the mods for these games alive!!!

 

Which brings me to some inquires I have about the state of modding these games. Right now because of the lack of official tools to mod these games and engine limitations there are a lot of areas in modding that simply cannot be done at all, or to the best of my knowledge can be done but require an amazing amount of work to do that a lot of people simply do not have the time to do. I was just wondering if one day it will be possible to surpass these limitations and mod KOTOR and TSL the way people mod a game such as Skyrim.

 

For example would it ever be possible to do things like the following:

 

• Make completely new modules easily {I say easily because this is possible but is very time consuming from what I understand.}
• Make new animations for these games such as combat animations.
• Create completely new enemies and characters.
• Create new minigames.
• As well as other things I have not thought of lol!

 

Thanks for taking the time to read this I look forward to hearing your thoughts on this.

 

P.S

Please do not mistake my tone in this post for displeasure with the current mods and modding tools here or anywhere else, I think that these are amazing tools to work with and am very pleased we have been able to mod these games at all.

[superSzym 155]

Completely new characters and animations are possible and quite common these days.

 

Creating new modules would never be easy. When you create a new module, you have to make its model, specify which texture should come where, place additional things not included in the main model, place doors and characters - it takes time and needs a bit of effort. As Sith Holocron once said, mod release dates are for those who don't care about quality.

 

Actually, TSL has proven this statement true even for things much bigger than mods. The need of finishing the game for Christmas made it rushed and, this time quoting Zbyl2 and his speech about TSLRCM, it took five years to achieve what would take Obsidian additional two months.

 

I do not know nothing about new minigames, probably because it wasn't the most beloved part of the game for most of the players, especially those impossibly difficult K1 turret games, at least for me. TSL minigames were fun for me.

[Fair Strides 509]

Welcome back into the fold! One of us! One of us! One of us!!!

 

Ahem, sorry about that. What was I saying? Oh yes.

 

---

 

It might one day be possible to model areas easily as you put it, but that day is sadly not today. I do have ideas for how such a thing could be achieved, but as with everything else, there is the war between Time and Priorities.

 

We can overwrite the current animations at any time and to any extent, but the games are very limited in this nature. We can overwrite any of the animations that exist, but the game won't recognize any that aren't named after a set list of possible names.

 

Should I assume you mean modelling and texturing something brand new? This is currently a possibility, as has been proven by mods such as this.

 

We aren't able to completely decrypt the source code behind the two minigames (the turrets and the swoops), but we could design new minigames using either of those two systems, or a mix between them. We can't do anything outside of those two systems in terms of actual minigames.

 

Last parameter too vague. Please try again with more specific inputs. Have a nice day!

 

---

 

In all honesty, there is so much that we can do with these games, even with the limitations we're under. If you ever have an interest in seeing how things are done, learning something, or just showing support, I'm going to be holding a streaming event in about a month.

 

http://deadlystream.com/forum/blog/64/entry-169-a-proposal-for-scripting/

[Hobbes 1]

Completely new characters and animations are possible and quite common these days.

 

Creating new modules would never be easy. When you create a new module, you have to make its model, specify which texture should come where, place additional things not included in the main model, place doors and characters - it takes time and needs a bit of effort. As Sith Holocron once said, mod release dates are for those who don't care about quality.

 

Actually, TSL has proven this statement true even for things much bigger than mods. The need of finishing the game for Christmas made it rushed and, this time quoting Zbyl2 and his speech about TSLRCM, it took five years to achieve what would take Obsidian additional two months.

 

I do not know nothing about new minigames, probably because it wasn't the most beloved part of the game for most of the players, especially those impossibly difficult K1 turret games, at least for me. TSL minigames were fun for me.

 

Thanks for replying!  It's so true about the quote regarding mod release dates. I agree, the K1 Turret games are difficult (arrow keys make it a bit easier for me.)

 

Welcome back into the fold! One of us! One of us! One of us!!!

 

Ahem, sorry about that. What was I saying? Oh yes.

 

---

 

It might one day be possible to model areas easily as you put it, but that day is sadly not today. I do have ideas for how such a thing could be achieved, but as with everything else, there is the war between Time and Priorities.

 

We can overwrite the current animations at any time and to any extent, but the games are very limited in this nature. We can overwrite any of the animations that exist, but the game won't recognize any that aren't named after a set list of possible names.

 

Should I assume you mean modelling and texturing something brand new? This is currently a possibility, as has been proven by mods such as this.

 

We aren't able to completely decrypt the source code behind the two minigames (the turrets and the swoops), but we could design new minigames using either of those two systems, or a mix between them. We can't do anything outside of those two systems in terms of actual minigames.

 

Last parameter too vague. Please try again with more specific inputs. Have a nice day!

 

---

 

In all honesty, there is so much that we can do with these games, even with the limitations we're under. If you ever have an interest in seeing how things are done, learning something, or just showing support, I'm going to be holding a streaming event in about a month.

 

http://deadlystream.com/forum/blog/64/entry-169-a-proposal-for-scripting/

 

Thanks for welcoming me back into the fold! Sometimes I take extended breaks, I think so that when I come back to it, it seems new and interesting all over again! It's really cool that you have some ideas and of course time and priorities do have to be considered. I understand that. Thanks for the explanation about overwriting the animations, that makes sense! Yes, I was talking about modelling and texturing something new, such as if someone wanted to add a new Alien species complete with animations, but then of course we run into that animation issue you spoke of. I've not seen that mod yet, will have to check it out, thanks! That sounds interesting about the minigames. My vague 'as well as other things I've not thought of' is sort of to open up conversation about any other types of mods/limitations that I might not be aware of. I agree, it was vague! I will definitely want to attend that stream, thanks for letting me know.

[Hunters Run 57]

 

We can overwrite the current animations at any time and to any extent, but the games are very limited in this nature. We can overwrite any of the animations that exist, but the game won't recognize any that aren't named after a set list of possible names.

Actually, you can create brand new animations without replacing any by adding new lines to animations.2da. The caveat is that this only works for tsl and dialogue(I don't know if you can trigger new combat animations).

[Teddy273 4]

I didn't want to create a new topic but I was wondering about something : With both kotor games now being more than 10 years old, and given EA and Bioware have no plans for future sequels for kotor other than swtor, would it now be possible to imagine Bioware (or Obsidian?) sharing their development tools with the modding community (like Bethesda always does with their TES or Fallout games) ? Or did someone already attempt to contact them about that matter? After all, access to such tools would make modders' life incredibly easier and new mods ideas that would currently be very hard or even impossible to create, possible.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

I didn't want to create a new topic but I was wondering about something : With both kotor games now being more than 10 years old, and given EA and Bioware have no plans for future sequels for kotor other than swtor, would it now be possible to imagine Bioware (or Obsidian?) sharing their development tools with the modding community (like Bethesda always does with their TES or Fallout games) ? Or did someone already attempt to contact them about that matter? After all, access to such tools would make modders' life incredibly easier and new mods ideas that would currently be very hard or even impossible to create, possible.

I think someone tried recently, I don't know how far that person got though.

 

It's pretty unlikely that they would release their development tools. Besides, we've gotten to the point where we can do pretty much do everything.

[Quanon 263]

I didn't want to create a new topic but I was wondering about something : With both kotor games now being more than 10 years old, and given EA and Bioware have no plans for future sequels for kotor other than swtor, would it now be possible to imagine Bioware (or Obsidian?) sharing their development tools with the modding community (like Bethesda always does with their TES or Fallout games) ? Or did someone already attempt to contact them about that matter? After all, access to such tools would make modders' life incredibly easier and new mods ideas that would currently be very hard or even impossible to create, possible.

 

I think this question popped up once with an interview with Chris Avellone, from Obsidian, writer for TSL. I believe he said that lots of code, builds and tools get "deleted" to make room for the new projects they work on. They don't archive those and there is nothing really left. Plus they couldn't share anything, even, if they would like to do that. It's all about the contracts with the publisher (EA?, can't remember) and LucasArts at that time.

[Vriff 21]

I have tried multiple times. Chris said they can't release anything due to them not owning it (Bioware does). Bioware is a ghost of a company with no soul and could not be reached for comment.

[VarsityPuppet 1,085]

I have tried multiple times. Chris said they can't release anything due to them not owning it (Bioware does). Bioware is a ghost of a company with no soul and could not be reached for comment.

 

Tell us how you really feel though