MOD:Extended Enclave Patch

[N-DReW25 1,336]

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Extended Enclave Patch

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Extended Enclave Patch
A Mod for Star Wars Knights of The Old Republic 2
Author: N-DReW25
1.0.0 Release Date: 26.02.2021
1.0.2 Release Date: 28.05.2021

INSTALLATION:
(It is highly recommended that you update your game to version 2.10 (the 1.0b update) before installing this mod.) 
As this is an add-on for TSLRCM, TSLRCM 1.8.6 is REQUIRED. It will not work otherwise, so have that installed first.
As this is a patch for Extended Enclave, Extended Enclave 2.5.1 is REQUIRED. It will not work otherwise. So have that after TSLRCM and before Extended Enclave Patch.

M4-78EP appears to be fully compatible with Extended Enclave, so no compatibility patch for M4-78EP and Extended Enclave Patch exists at this time.
The M4-78EP compatibility patch for M4-78EP checks to see if Master Vash is present amongst the Jedi Masters, this is impossible to achieve in M4-78EP so therefore this mod won't break with M4-78EP.
But REGARDLESS, please leave feedback if you play with M4-78EP of both ANY BUGS you may encounter or if your game WORKED with M4-78.

To install, extract the Extended Enclave Patch folder to anywhere you like, as long as it is not the SWKotOR2 folder. When you run the installer, it will present you with two options, the option "Main Installation" is REQUIRED base mod and "CARTH FIX" is OPTIONAL, select "Main Installation" and run it.

"CARTH FIX" can be installed after "Main Installation", this option fixes an inconsistency with Carth's armor as seen in TSLRCM. DO NOT USE THIS OPTION if you use DarthParametric's "TOR Ports: KOTOR Comic Republic Uniforms Admiralty Patch"

Uninstallation:
Depends on what you've chosen to install
Copy the files within the generated "backup" folder and place the file inside your modules folder, make sure you overwrite.

Description:
This is a patch for the Extended Enclave mod which extends version the Rebuilt Enclave sequence with new restored dialogue, scenes and other missing content. 
The following scenes have been modified:

1. "Tobin's Message"
Previously in TSLRCM and Extended Enclave, Tobin's scene with Nihilus was totally unzippable. Presumably as this scene harboured important information regarding the games plot, specifically how Nihilus came to discover Telos and why he chose to attack it. This patch makes it so that the player can skip through most of Tobin's dialogues and get back into the action.

2. "Admiration"
Scenes in the Jedi Enclave where the dialogue shows an animated fly-by camera have now been made unskippable for the duration of the camera, this was done to allow players to admire the scene for a brief moment rather than mindlessly skip it like you can in vanilla

3. "Disciple's Choice."
The "Disciple's Choice" restored content has been moved from the Ebon Hawk to the Enclave. Once inside the Enclave, Kreia telepathically goads Disciple into telling the Republic what's happening but in doing so, he'd endanger the Exile.

3. "Disciple's Distress Call"
Knowing that Kreia is a Sith and that the Exile and Jedi were in danger, the Disciple instead contacts Atris for help who in turn sends her Handmaidens to Dantooine.

4. "Alternate Lines."
A handful of 'alternate lines' exist within the Enclave files including:

2nd takes like:
Extended Enclave: "Including Master Zhar. Master Vandar." -> Patch: "Including Master Zhar... Master Vandar..."

From alternate lines like:
Extended Enclave: "And at last, you saw." -> Patch: "And at last, you saw the truth."

To totally expanded lines like:
Extended Enclave: "Yeah... I know." -> Patch: "Yeah... and she knows it. She's known it all along. She's used your own ability to form connections against you."

5. "Reaching Out."
The Exile, believed to be deceased, will now be taken back to the Ebon Hawk where they will lie unconscious in the medical bay as the party believe them to be dead. The subsequent mind reading scene shall have additional lines.

6. "A bridge?"
A plot hole has been covered up, kinda. Once Kreia outs herself as a Sith to the party, she takes the Ebon Hawk to Telos with Handmaiden/s and once she departs the crew, with their leader seemingly dead, return to Dantooine just in-time for the Exile to recover.

7. "I have to do this, or I will die inside, just as I died at Malachor V."
Bao-Dur's mind reading scene will now include the famous TSLRP style animated camera.

In my opinion, this patch is a very small mod at the current time. In the future, I shall further update the mod with new content which I hope will touch upon the scenes including the Jedi Masters, Kreia, Visas, Sion and more!
 

Known Bugs:
This mod shouldn't have bugs but if there is Just PM me on Deadlystream.

Incompatibilities:
Report any incompatibilities to me on Deadlystream.com

Permissions:
This mod may not be modified or distributed without the explicit permission of the authors.

Thanks and Credits:
danil-ch & Darth Hayze: Extended Enclave mod and associated files
Zbyl2: Help with getting it ready for TSLRCM 1.8.6
JCarter426: TSLRP Inspired Camera
Leilukin: For her amazing Partywap compatibility patch
Sith Holocron: The Awesome logo and screenshot edits
Exile007: Sion related files
LoneWanderer: Extensive Beta Testing and identifying solutions to 1.0.0 bugs
Alex Star: Discovering the Sion Harbinger and Atris Academy Bypass bugs in version 1.0.0

mackmitchell94: Identifying issues with 1.0.1 installation
TSLRCM Team: TSLRCM 1.8.6 and associated files
Team Gizka: Creating the original Ebon hawk camera
Bioware: For such an amazing game
Obsidian: For such an amazing sequel and for keeping the cut content in the files
Fred Tetra: For Kotor Tool 
Everyone who downloads the mod!

Extended Enclave Credits:
danil-ch and Darth Hayze: Pretty much most stuff, this included lots of scripting, vo splicing, picking up slack when one of us disappeared, etc...
Thanks go the entire TSLRCM team; your work has been outstanding.
Hassat Hunter; for help with getting it ready for TSLRCM 1.8.2
Sith Holocron; for suggesting a mod collaboration and the cool logo
zbyl2; for help with getting it ready for TSLRCM 1.8.3
Exile007; for contribuitng his early work on the Sion scenes
TESTERS: Loki147, Malkior

Legal:
THIS MODIFICATION IS NOT SUPPORTED BY BIOWARE/OBSIDIAN ENTERTAINMENT, LUCASARTS, DISNEY OR ANY LICENSERS/SPONSORS OF THE MENTIONED COMPANIES. USE OF THIS FILE IS AT YOUR OWN RISK AND THE ABOVE-MENTIONED COMPANIES OR THE AUTHOR IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY DAMAGE CAUSED TO YOUR COMPUTER FOR THE USAGE OF THIS FILE.

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• Submitter
  N-DReW25
• Submitted
  02/26/2021
• Category
  Mods
• TSLRCM Compatible
  Yes

 

[Sith Holocron 2,478]

From what I recall from the Ravager, you could tell Tobin to assist with helping with the proton cores.  (I think there may have been a check to see if you could convince him.)  It would be nice to see a follow up on that and seeing as this mod already covers Tobin on the Ravager and you plan to do updates, it would niuce if something like this was included.  You could even it so that the proton core that inevitably explodes takes Colonel Tobin out? 

Just a thought.

Edit: This page should remind you all of the conversation with Tobin aboard the Ravager.

[sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY 60]

Since you mention Vash and M4-78, it might be cool to include a way for her to survive and turn up in the Dantooine council a la the old DStoney mod in future updates. Ditto Kaah, though I suppose he could have a Kaevee pulled on him. While I get the logistic necessity of them both dying on M4-78 anyway in LS paths, it always felt a tad lacklustre narratively. Obviously it'd require an M4-78 install version, but it's an idea.

[N-DReW25 1,336]

7 hours ago, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

Since you mention Vash and M4-78, it might be cool to include a way for her to survive and turn up in the Dantooine council a la the old DStoney mod in future updates. Ditto Kaah, though I suppose he could have a Kaevee pulled on him. While I get the logistic necessity of them both dying on M4-78 anyway in LS paths, it always felt a tad lacklustre narratively. Obviously it'd require an M4-78 install version, but it's an idea.

Ok, I had a bit of a further look into M4-78EP in recent months and discovered this: Assuming you killed Vrook, Zez-Kai Ell, Kavar and did M4-78 last only then do you have the opportunity to save Vash. I am 95% sure that is merely an Easter Egg by the devs and isn't something many players actually do.

 

I do plan on someday returning to the Extended Enclave Patch for some minor new additions for the mod, and maybe one day a "Save Vash" option might be possible... however, I most likely *will* require the use of experimental AI which can take samples of VO to make Vash say lines during the Enclave meeting and Kreia dialogue when referring to Vash (And maybe even Zhaboka to voice Kaah if I wanted him to make an appearance, just imagine: instead of Visas ambushing Kreia and getting forced choked it's Kaah instead).

[sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY 60]

Lol, everyone hates Kaah it seems. Probably best not to lose the Visas scene though, but I'm sure you'll figure something out.

[N-DReW25 1,336]

3 hours ago, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

Lol, everyone hates Kaah it seems.

I honestly don't know why, I found him to be one of the more enjoyable characters in the mod.

 

3 hours ago, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

Probably best not to lose the Visas scene though, but I'm sure you'll figure something out.

Allow me to clarify what my plan is on that:

 

Spoiler

 TSLRCM utilized the "Rebuilding the Jedi Enclave" Mod in their mod as that mod did fix a lot of bugs with the vanilla Enclave scene, the problem with this mod is that it uses custom content to restore certain things... and the most prominent custom content was in fact the Visas cutscene.

Spoiler

 

The part where Visas is onboard the Ebon Hawk when the Exile enters the Jedi Council Chamber only for her to somehow bypass Handmaiden and/or Kreia and somehow manage to ambush Kreia even though Kreia had arrived at the Enclave before Visas did was never Obsidian developer intent. You know what else wasn't developer intent? The part where Kreia Force chokes Visas, knocking her out and Kreia mocking Visas whilst kneeling over her, that was ALL added in by the "Rebuilding the Jed Enclave" as custom content.

 

So what was the original Obsidian developers intentions for the Kreia VS Visas scene? Well, it appeared as if... assuming the player is female and the Handmaiden was never recruited, then the player would get the Kreia VS Visas scene as a replacement for the Handmaiden scene.

 

Meaning the scene might've looked something more like this:

Spoiler

 

I'm going off of memory, Visas "might've" activated her Lightsaber just like in TSLRCM/RBTJE but Kreia certainly didn't do anything, she just sat down and spoke. At the end of the scene, the screen fades to black, a thudding sfx plays and the screen fades back in to reveal Visas is knocked out and Kreia walking towards the Council Chamber.

 

This IS actually something I plan to restore, albeit I think this will be optional as I'm sure we can agree that the original cut content design rightly sucks and only a die hard restored content fan (like me) would want it. 

 

How does this relate to Kaah?!
 

Well, keep in mind that the OG Kreia VS Visas scene was to take place before the Jedi Council scene actually started. Now let's assume I did manage to restore the OG Kreia VS Visas scene, what I would do is simply rework the RBTJE Kreia VS Visas scene to instead use Kaah in Visas' place and have Kaah be killed there and then.

 

[sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY 60]

On 8/17/2021 at 3:41 PM, N-DReW25 said:

I honestly don't know why, I found him to be one of the more enjoyable characters in the mod.

 

Allow me to clarify what my plan is on that:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 TSLRCM utilized the "Rebuilding the Jedi Enclave" Mod in their mod as that mod did fix a lot of bugs with the vanilla Enclave scene, the problem with this mod is that it uses custom content to restore certain things... and the most prominent custom content was in fact the Visas cutscene.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

The part where Visas is onboard the Ebon Hawk when the Exile enters the Jedi Council Chamber only for her to somehow bypass Handmaiden and/or Kreia and somehow manage to ambush Kreia even though Kreia had arrived at the Enclave before Visas did was never Obsidian developer intent. You know what else wasn't developer intent? The part where Kreia Force chokes Visas, knocking her out and Kreia mocking Visas whilst kneeling over her, that was ALL added in by the "Rebuilding the Jed Enclave" as custom content.

 

So what was the original Obsidian developers intentions for the Kreia VS Visas scene? Well, it appeared as if... assuming the player is female and the Handmaiden was never recruited, then the player would get the Kreia VS Visas scene as a replacement for the Handmaiden scene.

 

Meaning the scene might've looked something more like this:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

I'm going off of memory, Visas "might've" activated her Lightsaber just like in TSLRCM/RBTJE but Kreia certainly didn't do anything, she just sat down and spoke. At the end of the scene, the screen fades to black, a thudding sfx plays and the screen fades back in to reveal Visas is knocked out and Kreia walking towards the Council Chamber.

 

This IS actually something I plan to restore, albeit I think this will be optional as I'm sure we can agree that the original cut content design rightly sucks and only a die hard restored content fan (like me) would want it. 

 

How does this relate to Kaah?!
 

Well, keep in mind that the OG Kreia VS Visas scene was to take place before the Jedi Council scene actually started. Now let's assume I did manage to restore the OG Kreia VS Visas scene, what I would do is simply rework the RBTJE Kreia VS Visas scene to instead use Kaah in Visas' place and have Kaah be killed there and then.

 

Sounds interesting - though I suppose it raises the question of what to do when the option of reworking Visas's encounter isn't installed.

Also, I left a comment on the mod page itself, but you might 've missed it. You might be aware that there's a compatibility patch for Partyswap with Extended Enclave, that includes an option for if this patch is installed. Unfortunately going by the last update and what I can see from the comments, a specific encounter with this patch is broken to the point that it simply removes the encounter - Disciple and Brianna's involvement in the mind-reading part. The modder doesn't know how to change the scripts to spawn the right characters, by the looks of it. Do you reckon you might be able to help out? No pressure or anything, just you seem to have a lot of scripting knowledge, so I figured it couldn't hurt to ask.

[N-DReW25 1,336]

On 8/20/2021 at 4:54 AM, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

Sounds interesting - though I suppose it raises the question of what to do when the option of reworking Visas's encounter isn't installed.

That's true, that proposal is just an idea though.

 

On 8/20/2021 at 4:54 AM, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

Also, I left a comment on the mod page itself, but you might 've missed it. You might be aware that there's a compatibility patch for Partyswap with Extended Enclave, that includes an option for if this patch is installed.

Yes, I am aware of that compatibility patch as I was the one who requested it be made. I'm always thinking 5 steps ahead.

 

On 8/20/2021 at 4:54 AM, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

Unfortunately going by the last update, and what I can see from the comments,

Just want to clarify here, the last update of my Extended Enclave Patch fixed the game breaking Darth Sion Peragus bug.

 

On 8/20/2021 at 4:54 AM, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

a specific encounter with this patch is broken to the point that it simply removes the encounter - Disciple and Brianna's involvement in the mind-reading part.

My memory is sketchy... but I do believe that bug is present in the Extended Enclave patch as well, it's not just my patch which has it.

 

On 8/20/2021 at 4:54 AM, sEcOnDbOuToFiNsAnItY said:

The modder doesn't know how to change the scripts to spawn the right characters, by the looks of it. Do you reckon you might be able to help out? No pressure or anything, just you seem to have a lot of scripting knowledge, so I figured it couldn't hurt to ask.

I could take a look at it in the future, though I am unfamiliar with how the whole Handmaiden/Disciple thing works in terms of scripting and Party Swap... I could totally learn it in the future, but at this time I'm in the same lake as Leilukin AND I released this mod as a means of clearing up space for Revenge of Revan (This mod was more of a pain in the ass to development then you could possible imagine, lol)

[HDR1 5]

Hi,

It's been a while since I last posted here but I recently did a complete new install of Kotor 2 with a variety of mods, including this one. I've reached the Enclave scene with a female exile and it worked fine, no bugs, and I really enjoyed the new scenes as well. However, I think some of the changes need improvement or removal. Here are my suggestions.

1. Kreia's "And at last, you saw the truth." line.

While it was cool to hear this alternate take, I think the original line is better. It's a bit more mysterious but more importantly, the voice acting is better for the original line. The voice for "And at last, you saw the truth." almost sounds like it belongs in a completely different scene. Her previous lines about "hearing" and "being made whole" have the same style of performance, ""And at last, you saw the truth." however sounds completely different. I don't think this alternate take is good enough to justify this change. In fact, the voice performance makes it sound like it doesn't belong in this scene. Kreia's delivery makes it sound like it's part of a normal conversation, not a monumental scene like this.

2. The second suggestion is for the following features of the mod:

Quote

5. "Reaching Out."
The Exile, believed to be deceased, will now be taken back to the Ebon Hawk where they will lie unconscious in the medical bay as the party believe them to be dead. The subsequent mind reading scene shall have additional lines.

6. "A bridge?"
A plot hole has been covered up, kinda. Once Kreia outs herself as a Sith to the party, she takes the Ebon Hawk to Telos with Handmaiden/s and once she departs the crew, with their leader seemingly dead, return to Dantooine just in-time for the Exile to recover.

The way you handled this is pretty creative, and I can see that you tried to tie all these events together to be cohesive and fill in the hole in the plot. However, to be honest, I don't think there was a plot hole here at all - Kreia would obviously have been taken to Atris on the ship the Handmaidens used to get to Dantooine after she knocked out the crew. In fact, by bringing the exile on board the Ebon Hawk and having Kreia use it to get to Telos, you actually created new plot problems.

The exile being taken to the Ebon Hawk doesn't work very well. The party is all there, why don't they notice she's not dead? Previously Kreia was lying to them and it made sense. Having the exile on board complicates this as it really doesn't make sense that nobody notices she's alive. There's nothing in the enclave scene to suggest the exile is temporarily dead, she was just knocked out. Not only that, but why would Kreia want to bring the exile on board? This is the point in the story where she begins to reclaim the title of Darth Traya and abandons the exile. Kreia taking the exile to the ship leaves the possibility open for the exile to catch up to her before she reaches Malachor V. The exile waking up up too early is all it would take. Why would Kreia take such a pointless risk when she's been a master planner and manipulator so far?

So then Kreia takes the Ebon Hawk to Telos...why? The Handmaidens obviously had to arrive on their own ship, why would they take the Ebon Hawk? Not just that, but since the exile is aboard the Ebon Hawk in your mod, Kreia would definitely not take the ship. What if the exile woke up too early and confronted Kreia and Atris? What if Atris was told by the Handmaidens that the exile is dead on the ship? What if then Atris demanded to see the exile's body, since she was obsessed with the exile? Kreia going there on the Ebon Hawk is awkward for the plot already, her bringing the exile along just makes it worse. Having the Ebon Hawk go to Telos opens up a bunch of possibilities in the plot that shouldn't be there.

Then Atton and the crew take the ship back to Dantooine... but because the exile is already on the ship, there's no reason for them to do this. Why are they going back to Dantooine? They could have gone anywhere, or even just drift in space, there's no reason for them to go back to Dantooine in particular. The only reason this happens is because the Ebon Hawk needs to be away from Telos for the plot to work. By adding a trip to Telos you complicated the situation and created a problem in the plot, now the Ebon Hawk has to awkwardly go back to Dantooine, so that when the exile wakes up, she can tell Atton to take the ship to Telos.

This whole sequence of events is very awkward. Kreia takes the Hawk to Telos, then the party takes it back to Dantooine, then the exile wakes up and they immediately take it back to Telos again. It's just running back and forth in an attempt to connect everything to the Ebon Hawk. Not to mention it is also awkward because when the exile wakes up, she finds Atton in the cockpit on the ground in pain. If Atton piloted the ship back to Dantooine, why is he in pain on the floor when the exile wakes up? Originally, the exile finds Atton shortly after Kreia knocks everyone out, so it (mostly) makes sense. With this mod, it doesn't.

In fact, with your mod, when the exile talks to Atton, he says the Handmaidens took Kreia and they will take her to Atris - clearly, the way he talks suggests that Kreia left the Ebon Hawk, and that all this happened a short time ago and Kreia may still be on her way to Atris. Your mod's version of events has Kreia take the Hawk and the crew to Telos and then the crew coming back without her. The sequence of events you created contradicts what Atton says in the game.

My suggestion would be this:

• Have the enclave scenes happen the way they are in your mod up until the exile is knocked out and the Handmaidens arrive for Kreia.
• Afterwards, the exile should not be taken to the Ebon Hawk. Leave the exile inside the enclave.
• Keep Kreia's Ebon Hawk scene the same. She tells the party the exile is dead, they all talk, then Kreia knocks them all out and leaves the ship with the Handmaidens. The implication is there that the Handmaidens are taking Kreia to Atris on their own ship. The only thing you'd need to change is to not have the exile's body on the ship. Optionally, if you want to make the implication of Kreia leaving on the Handmaiden ship stronger, just have Kreia and the Handmaidens walk toward the Ebon Hawk's exit at the end of the scene.
• Then the subsequent mind reading scene happens, followed by the Sion-Nihilus confrontation.
• Then the exile wakes up in the enclave in Dantooine. This would allow the player to look around, examine the Jedi Masters' bodies, and pick up some loot in the enclave. (Also, it would restore the message for obtaining Force Enlightenment or Force Crush, which your mod doesn't have. When the player regains control in your mod on Telos, you are given the Force Power without any message, if I hadn't checked my powers in the menu, I wouldn't have known I had it.)
• Then the player has to go back to the Hawk (or maybe the exile could be teleported there upon exiting the enclave door) and the scenes continue with the exile finding Atton in the cockpit in pain. From here, things go the same way as they do normally, with the exile going to Telos.

Overall I really like what you've done with the enclave scenes in the mod but the exile's body being brought to the Ebon Hawk and the Hawk going back and forth between Dantooine and Telos really hurt the mod in my opinion. By trying to connect these things together, you've created "what if" possibilities that shouldn't be there. What if the crew noticed the exile wasn't dead, what if the exile woke up before Kreia reached Telos, what if Atris or the Handmaidens put the crew in force cages again... these are issues with Kreia's plan that didn't exist in the original game. They are not exactly plotholes but they hurt the plot and Kreia's character, because up until that point, her plan was flawless. You overcomplicated what should have just been the Handmaidens taking Kreia to Telos on their own ship, and you also removed the chance to explore the rebuilt Jedi Enclave and examine the Jedi Masters' bodies, which actually gives you an important message that clarifies what Kreia did to them by robbing them of the Force. 

Sorry for the wall of text but I'm not a native English speaker so I have trouble being concise. I suppose the tldr version would be that you should change the mod so that you don't put the exile on the Hawk after the enclave scene, he/she should wake up in the enclave like in the normal game, and Kreia should not take the Ebon Hawk to Telos, instead she should just go with the Handmaidens, implying that they have a ship to take her with.

I know the post has been pretty negative, but just so you know, I really enjoyed everything else in the mod. Your additional lines and scenes added a lot to the enclave scene, I particularly loved the Disciple's added lines, those improved the plot by connecting the Handmaidens arrival to him asking for their help. So please don't take this as me not liking the mod, because I really do, it's just that the changes I mentioned above really stick out to me and I think they could be improved. I was absolutely loving your mod until the exile was taken to the ship and Kreia used the Ebon Hawk to get to Telos. These two things completely broke my immersion.

[LoneWanderer 103]

8 hours ago, HDR1 said:

However, to be honest, I don't think there was a plot hole here at all - Kreia would obviously have been taken to Atris on the ship the Handmaidens used to get to Dantooine after she knocked out the crew. In fact, by bringing the exile on board the Ebon Hawk and having Kreia use it to get to Telos, you actually created new plot problems.

While I can't speak for N-DReW25, he, probably, was thinking more about fixing this scene for male Exile. If you play as male, then Handmaidens won't appear in the Enclave. Instead, Brianna, the party member, takes Kreia to Telos. How did she get the ship on Dantooine if she was traveling with the Exile on the Ebon Hawk all this time? - this is a plot hole.

 

8 hours ago, HDR1 said:

The exile being taken to the Ebon Hawk doesn't work very well. The party is all there, why don't they notice she's not dead? Previously Kreia was lying to them and it made sense. Having the exile on board complicates this as it really doesn't make sense that nobody notices she's alive. There's nothing in the enclave scene to suggest the exile is temporarily dead, she was just knocked out.

At first I was also surprised by the Exile being taken to the Ebon Hawk. But it is assumed that the Exile was in Hibernation Trance from the shock/pain/effect of the force from the Council. In fact, in DS variant of the scene Kreia stabs herself (and hurt the Exile through their force bond) and says something like "Stay here and die, apprentice, among the wreckage of all that left of the Jedi" as she leaves, which suggests that the Exile is at the very least (mentally-)wounded.

The description of Hibernation Trance says: "Hibernation trance was a control-based ability that slowed the user's metabolism and breathing to a standstill, causing the individual to only use one tenth of the air of a normal individual. To all outward appearances, the individual appears to be dead; only thorough testing would determine that they were alive...  A hibernating Force-user would appear dead to all but another Force-user". The only non-novice force user in the party at this point is Visas, but she was trained as Sith, so I guess it's possible for her to not recognise Hibernation Trance.

 

8 hours ago, HDR1 said:

This whole sequence of events is very awkward. Kreia takes the Hawk to Telos, then the party takes it back to Dantooine, then the exile wakes up and they immediately take it back to Telos again. It's just running back and forth in an attempt to connect everything to the Ebon Hawk. Not to mention it is also awkward because when the exile wakes up, she finds Atton in the cockpit on the ground in pain. If Atton piloted the ship back to Dantooine, why is he in pain on the floor when the exile wakes up? Originally, the exile finds Atton shortly after Kreia knocks everyone out, so it (mostly) makes sense. With this mod, it doesn't.

A valid point. "Atton in the cockpit on the ground in pain" should definitely be fixed in next update.

About the Ebon Hawk I can suggest to not return the ship to Dantooine and leave it in space when the Exile returns to life. Like in the scene after Peragus, when Atton asks about the color of the Exile's lightsaber, you can see hyperspace through the cockpit. This will require changing the picture in the cockpit to hyperspace (or new picture with stars) and, perhaps, but not required, setting the position for Ebon Hawk on Galaxy Map. Hmm, but then it won't be possible to examine the Jedi Masters' bodies and completely explore the Enclave...

[HDR1 5]

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While I can't speak for N-DReW25, he, probably, was thinking more about fixing this scene for male Exile. If you play as male, then Handmaidens won't appear in the Enclave. Instead, Brianna, the party member, takes Kreia to Telos. How did she get the ship on Dantooine if she was traveling with the Exile on the Ebon Hawk all this time? - this is a plot hole.

This is a valid point and makes more sense. However, the game establishes that Brianna is capable of contacting the Handmaidens and Atris. It's really not that much of a plot hole. It makes sense and doesn't require outside information to assume that she contacts the Handmaidens and they come to take them away. Even more so because the next time we see Brianna is when Atris confronts her on Telos and she fights her sisters, then the exile arrives just in time to save Brianna from Atris who is about to kill her. So Brianna is not on the Ebon Hawk at this point, she arrives on Telos shortly before the exile and the crew. The only way this makes sense is if they don't take the Ebon Hawk to Telos. If they went there on the Ebon Hawk, then back to Dantooine, Atris would have ample time to kill Brianna while the Ebon Hawk is back on its way to Dantooine.

The only other explanation for this would be if Brianna took Kreia on the Ebon Hawk to Telos, then went back to Dantooine without going to see Atris, but that makes no sense for Brianna's character. Another reason why it doesn't make sense is because if she stays on the Hawk, then she would confront her sisters together with the exile, not alone. The only way she would fight her sisters alone, is if the exile and the rest of the crew is still on their way to Telos. The only logical way this could happen is if Kreia and Brianna go on a different ship than the Ebon Hawk, otherwise the timeline doesn't add up.

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At first I was also surprised by the Exile being taken to the Ebon Hawk. But it is assumed that the Exile was in Hibernation Trance from the shock/pain/effect of the force from the Council. In fact, in DS variant of the scene Kreia stabs herself (and hurt the Exile through their force bond) and says something like "Stay here and die, apprentice, among the wreckage of all that left of the Jedi" as she leaves, which suggests that the Exile is at the very least (mentally-)wounded.

The description of Hibernation Trance says: "Hibernation trance was a control-based ability that slowed the user's metabolism and breathing to a standstill, causing the individual to only use one tenth of the air of a normal individual. To all outward appearances, the individual appears to be dead; only thorough testing would determine that they were alive...  A hibernating Force-user would appear dead to all but another Force-user". The only non-novice force user in the party at this point is Visas, but she was trained as Sith, so I guess it's possible for her to not recognise Hibernation Trance.

While this could be a valid explanation, the problem I have with this, is that this is all an assumption based on a wiki entry. The game as far as I recall doesn't mention the Hibernation Trance, and if it does, it doesn't go in to detail. Kreia feigns her death with what is probably the Hibernation Trance, but that's it. Also, the description mentions that the trance makes you look physically dead but Force-users could tell if you were alive, and the crew is full of them. Even if we assume that they can't do it because they are novice Jedi, Visas is not only trained in the Force, she literally sees through the Force. If there is one person who should notice that the exile is alive, it's her. There is nothing to suggest that she wouldn't be able to see through the Hibernation Trance, especially when she constantly uses Force Sight.

Plus none of this would even be an issue if Kreia left the exile in the enclave chamber. This was my main point. Even if we assume that the crew doesn't notice that the exile is alive on the ship, the question remains: why would Kreia take the exile back to the ship or let the others take him/her back to the ship, when she wants to put distance between herself and the exile so that she can set the final parts of her plan in motion - namely making Atris realize her fall and going to Malachor V to regain control of it?

Your own dark side quote confirms this: "Stay here and die, apprentice, among the wreckage of all that left of the Jedi." Kreia allowing the exile's body to be brought back goes against what she says and puts her plan at potential risk.

My main point is not whether or not we can explain why the exile is believed to be dead using Star Wars lore, my point is that the questions I brought up only need to be brought up because N-DReW25's mod changes the plot. If Kreia just left the exile in the enclave, told everyone he/she was dead, then went off to Telos using a Handmaiden ship, there wouldn't be any issue, because the crew would not have the chance to confirm the exile's death with their own eyes.

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About the Ebon Hawk I can suggest to not return the ship to Dantooine and leave it in space when the Exile returns to life. Like in the scene after Peragus, when Atton asks about the color of the Exile's lightsaber, you can see hyperspace through the cockpit. This will require changing the picture in the cockpit to hyperspace (or new picture with stars) and, perhaps, but not required, setting the position for Ebon Hawk on Galaxy Map. Hmm, but then it won't be possible to examine the Jedi Masters' bodies and completely explore the Enclave...

I think that the easiest solution is to not use the Ebon Hawk at all for travel. Kreia just leaves with the Handmaidens if the exile is female or with Brianna, who we can validly presume contacts the Handmaidens for transport, if the exile is male. The Ebon Hawk staying on Dantooine is the easiest way to solve these issues without messing up the characterizations and timeline and allows for the exile to explore the enclave as well.

The only other solution I can think of would be that the crew leaves the exile in the enclave, then Kreia takes the Ebon Hawk to Telos. Then the crew go back to Dantooine for the exile. This would give the crew a reason to go back to Dantooine at least, but it would still cause problems, especially for a male exile as I mentioned in my first two paragraphs, due to the Brianna-Atris confrontation.

I honestly think the best solution is to leave the exile in the enclave, then the others on the Hawk have their talk, then Kreia leaves with Brianna/the Handmaidens on an implied different ship after she knocks out the crew to prevent them from interfering. The TSLRP stlye mind reading scene with the hyperspace ending doesn't need to be changed either. The exile is reading the crew's minds in that scene using the Force, we can just assume that the exile seeing a hyperspace tunnel in the cockpit is a hint from the Force on what to do next, maybe a vision of sorts, or even Kreia's way of telling the exile what to do, since the final line in the scene is Kreia's. Everything we see in that scene is not something the exile sees directly, but something the exile sees using their mind's eye so to speak, so the hyperspace tunnel being there as a Force-vision thing still makes sense.

Of course you could just remove the camera zooming into hyperspace, but I think it's too cool to be removed.

Plus as I mentioned in my first post, when the exile finds Atton in pain on the ship and asks what happened, Atton says something along the lines of "The Handmaidens took Kreia. They will bring her to Atris and she will probably execute her like she would any Sith." If Kreia takes the Ebon Hawk to Telos with Atton and everyone on board, and then Atton takes the ship away from Telos, then his lines here don't make sense. Atton's lines clearly suggest that Kreia left them behind and he doesn't know exactly what happened, or how far along Kreia is to reaching Atris, he just knows what Kreia intended to do. If Atton had been along for the ride on the Ebon Hawk, he would be saying much more specific things like "The Handmaidens took us to Telos and brought Kreia before Atris. She is probably planning to execute her as we speak. I flew the rest of us out of there."

[horsti772 0]

On 8/17/2021 at 12:42 PM, N-DReW25 said:

Ok, I had a bit of a further look into M4-78EP in recent months and discovered this: Assuming you killed Vrook, Zez-Kai Ell, Kavar and did M4-78 last only then do you have the opportunity to save Vash. I am 95% sure that is merely an Easter Egg by the devs and isn't something many players actually do.

If I have M4-78 installed I personally like the option to fight Vash in the Enclave. Sadly that's not possible with the Extended Enclave patch. Would there be a possibility to add an option like the original Extended Enclave did? (Or am I the only one who does weird stuff like that? :D)

 

Also I think I found a bug. If the player kills the 3 Jedi Masters and goes into the Enclave alone, the cutscene with Kreia starts where she sits down, then she says "The years have not been kind to us both, it seems.", then the screen goes black and nothing happens.

I looked it up in DLGEditor and the Dialogue ends there:

In Extended Enclave it continues and starts "a_jediarrive":

[N-DReW25 1,336]

19 hours ago, horsti772 said:

If I have M4-78 installed I personally like the option to fight Vash in the Enclave. Sadly that's not possible with the Extended Enclave patch. Would there be a possibility to add an option like the original Extended Enclave did? (Or am I the only one who does weird stuff like that? :D)

Considering the M4-78 mod is literally infamous for having Vash die on M4-78, can you forgive me that I didn't know about the Easter Egg ending where Vash goes to Dantooine if the other Jedi Masters are already dead?

 

19 hours ago, horsti772 said:

Also I think I found a bug. If the player kills the 3 Jedi Masters and goes into the Enclave alone, the cutscene with Kreia starts where she sits down, then she says "The years have not been kind to us both, it seems.", then the screen goes black and nothing happens.

I looked it up in DLGEditor and the Dialogue ends there:

So what you're saying is the original EE mod had the blank red dialogue fade to black with the blue response dialogue executing a script to continue the Enclave whereas my mod removed the blue response thus removing the script thus breaking the game?
If that is so, I'll get around to making an update.

 

I've been meaning on updating this mod for a while now, I'll hopefully get around to it soon!

[horsti772 0]

7 minutes ago, N-DReW25 said:

Considering the M4-78 mod is literally infamous for having Vash die on M4-78, can you forgive me that I didn't know about the Easter Egg ending where Vash goes to Dantooine if the other Jedi Masters are already dead?

It would be great if you find some time to add it. But you don't have to (I guess I'm the only one whos playing it that way... ^^)

8 minutes ago, N-DReW25 said:

So what you're saying is the original EE mod had the blank red dialogue fade to black with the blue response dialogue executing a script to continue the Enclave whereas my mod removed the blue response thus removing the script thus breaking the game?

Yep, the blue option which starts a_jediarrive is missing in EEPatch, which leads to the blackscreen and nothing happening afterwards. (After saving and loading the game the player can walk around the enclave and if "sitting" Kreia is clicked the wrong scene plays)