71 replies to this topic

[GovernorTarkin]

http://social.bioware.com/forum/Mass-Effect-3/Mass-Effect-3-Story-and-Campaign-Discussion-Spoilers-Allowed/EABioware-in-Full-PR-Damage-Control-Mode-UPDATED-10084349-1.html

THIS IS SOME INTERESTING SHIT ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON RIGHT NOW WITH ME3, YOU ALL SHOULD READ.

Yeah, a lot of the info on those forums are quite interesting, especially the ones concerning the endings. The only problem is you have to read through hundreds of pages on some of them. Now my question is if they fix the ending(i'm still hoping they will, but thats just me) do you think it should(IT WON'T) be free

[Kerk]

I'll tell you this, if they have conscience, they will make a free DLC. But we're all realists, and we don't expect that to happen. Most of us are prepared to pay for a DLC fix for a reasonable price.
Meanwhile, the situation is getting more and more interesting. Now the movement is facing a strong reaction in the face of so-called "game observers." There a lot of them who speak bullshit about this fan outrage. I'm still trying to understand why. Most of them seem to favor 2 arguments:
1) "The game is a work of art, and you, douchebags, don't tell artists what to do." Some of them stick really hard to this one. And it gets me thinking that they all must have graduated from the School of Liberal Arts. But really, we understand that this is BS. It is the company itself whom people hold liable, not the authors of the game. It's been said many times that the game would give us closure, which turned out to be simple false advertisement. And of course, we all know that be a game a work of art as it may, it's still business in the first place, and in business consumers have a say. Big time.
2) "It is the journey that matters, not the destination." I just love this BS. One particularly clever atheist thinker said "we all gonna die; so does it mean that our lives were not valuable?" Well, actually yes that's exactly how I see it. But most of yall probably won't share my idealist intuition. But here's a comeback to this argument: a destination is a PART of a journey. If a person, has a crazy ride on a rollercoaster and then runs into a wall and dies, do we want to say that his ride was generally great? Of course not, it would have been great, if it wasn't ruined.
Anyway, that's where we at for now. Why did I write all this stuff here? hmmm... maybe because I hate companies and I really want to prevent them from enslaving our souls completely. And I certainly don't want them to sell us shit and then cover themselves behind the shield called "art."

[drunklol]

- Spoilers ahead - read at own risk

Imo you should also check this one out.
I don't know if bioware did made the game ending like it is on purpose with something in mind or it's justt shitty but i don't find any other plausible explanation for the ending than this theory therefore i have to believe

[GovernorTarkin]

http://blog.bioware.com/
Dr. Ray Muzyka responds to fans about ending.

[VarsityPuppet]

Read this earlier today. Looks like Bioware is willing to work with us on this one. I think he handled that pretty well.

Not selling out to fans, but willing to improve their product and throw us a bone.

I respect you, Bioware.

EDIT:

Actually, now I'm kind of bummed that I haven't played the game yet and won't get a chance to provide feedback for the new ME3 ending... well unless they're still working on the DLC by May.

[GovernorTarkin]

Can't wait to hear exactly what they will be doing. I wish it was already April.

Do you guys feel that bioware's decision to "possibly" change, most likely add to, the ending sets a dangerous precedent? I just watched this video(http://www.ign.com/v...erous-precedent) in which colin moriarty says that fans shouldn't have the power to influence game developers. Fans absolutely should, and obviously can, have the ability to tell companies like bioware what they didn't like about their game. If enough people are loud enough, check the amazon.com reviews, as a developer its just bad business to ignore them.

P.S. I'm really starting to dislike ign.

[Kerk]

Gosh, are you all really buying this? He is twisting and turning to give you sense of security. What is he promising in that statement? That they will work hard? That they are listening? That they will bring more clarity? That doesn't mean that they will fix all the mess. He explicitly says that the game is their work of art, and they gonna defend it. It is obvious that they will make a DLC with ADDITIONAL content in regard to the ending, but not change the ending itself.

By the way, what is wrong with that guy's face? Is he deliberately so pompus?

[VarsityPuppet]

Sense of security? Bioware is trying to trick me? What is there to hide really?

The guy said they're listening to fan input and trying to accomodate fans suggestions, but not changing the essential ending. Cool, so they're maintaining the artistic integrity of the story and expanding on it too? Cool

Sounds fine to me. Then again, I haven't played ME3 to know its ending (but from what I heard it's not that bad). Even if they fuck up the DLC, and the ending still sucks, who cares really? Life goes on.

[Kerk]

I do. Cause I pay money. And as life goes on I get sucked into the corporate soulless domain deeper and deeper. This protest is the way of saying to them "you don't own us." And a simple "bone throwing" won't do here.

PS. oh and check this one out. It's a spot on article with no spoilers
http://www.forbes.co...ending-sort-of/

[VarsityPuppet]

Meh. Just sounds like angry fans to me.

If you don't want to be lured into the vortex of big business, stop buying their products. Each and every thing you buy is considered as a vote to keep producing future products.

I frankly don't understand what the big deal is. All I see is that Bioware is listening to its customers and is willing to modify their 'art' so as to make more people happy. Happens here all the time.

As a modder, I know how this feels. You put your all into a project and give it TLC and when you release it, there's always some guy who has to go and say it isn't good enough or that it's flawed in some quintessential way. Here at DS it doesn't matter much, but when your job and way of life depends on selling those games, you try to rectify that as best as possible. And of course when doing so, actually providing feedback instead of just trolling is going to help things progress.

If anything, this move by Bioware isn't so much condescending as it is a sell-out. But with a game that caters to personal choice so much like Mass Effect, it's hard to make your own artistic story and at the same time cater to what fans want.

So maybe that 'sorry for making a crap ending, but...' apology you're hearing from that Ray dude is Bioware trying to NOT sell out to their fans but realizing they could have done a better job on the flipside.

Too bad that even by doing that they're selling out.

[Kerk]

Puppet, let's be clear about things.

1) you don't understand the full situation, because you haven't played the game, and that's fine. But in such conversations it makes it harder to be constructive and not give up spoilers. So much stuff is called "trolling" these days that I frankly lost the conception of what it used to stand for.

2)But even when you do play the game, I'm sure that you at best will say something like "yeah that's pretty cheap, but oh well." Because you seem to have made little emotional investment into ME story and characters, and that's also fine. I didn't care for that "redneck in space" campaign in Star Craft 2, but many people did. And when they say something in protest, you cannot just discard them as crybabies. That's disrespectful.

3) You perfectly understand the difference between independent modders and a corporation. But there is more - there is a bunch of commercial statements that promised people certain things, and those promises were not fulfilled. And that's false advertisement. If that doesn't entitle you to complain, then I don't know what does.

4) Bioware selling out? You'll have to clarify this one for me.....it's a COR-PO-RA-TI-ON. They sell out to us the moment they start their business. Or at least that's the idea.

5) And finally, well this response "those guys are just crybabies" or "it's a raging mob" ....you know it's the kind of argument intellectual elites used to make for centuries to justify oligarchy, aristocracy and monarchy. It posits human beings in general as vile selfish beings. And this is not true. Even those who yell "fuk bioware" mostly express their deep dissatisfaction and trauma. Don't make it a custom to look down at people, cause I see a lot of reporters taking that road.

That being said, I love what you're doing on DS, and I would never dare challenge your artistic view of how things should be done in our sphere of modding. But I do not believe that any of the modders here would ever mess things up as the guys from Bioware did.

[VarsityPuppet]

Well since I have not played Mass Effect 3 (because I am quite obviously NOT a true fan that's even remotely emotionally invested in the game), I will have to leave this discussion until then.

But before I do, I'll leave with these last few words.

2)But even when you do play the game, I'm sure that you at best will say something like "yeah that's pretty cheap, but oh well." Because you seem to have made little emotional investment into ME story and characters, and that's also fine.

Don't assume that because my opinions are different than yours that I have a lesser investment in my own Mass Effect experience as a whole. You weren't there when I played it, so you have no idea what the hell was going on in my mind.

The implication alone leaves me extremely offended.

Secondly, while I haven't played Mass Effect 3 (much less reached the end), how does that fact disqualify any input I have to say on the topic of Bioware fixing content based on fan feedback (whether constructive or destructive)?

I'll let that slide though.

...Don't make it a custom to look down at people, cause I see a lot of reporters taking that road...

Wait, isn't that what you just did to me?


Okay, this is getting annoying.

That being said, I love what you're doing on DS, and I would never dare challenge your artistic view of how things should be done in our sphere of modding.

It's really hard for me to not see this as extremely condescending, based on your previous statements...



......




................


...Ah what the hell?




Fuck you, you presumptuous dick.


VP out.

[Kerk]

Hm, that was rather weird...oh well, since he left, no reson to respond. That's a shame really.

[GovernorTarkin]

Kerk i didn't buy what he was saying hook, line and sinker. I just chose merely to stay optimistic about the whole situation, i'm tired of all the pessimism surrounding this game. despite the ending it truly is a really good game.

Having just played through the game for a 3rd time(i can't stop myself) i can't see anything in the ending other than the ID theory. I have also come to believe that bioware planned this from the start, they just didn't foresee the giant shit-storm. Maybe i give them too much credit. Pax East starts april 6th, and i believe thats when bioware will make their announcement and i'm merely excited to hear what it is, but if its just about multiplayer then i'll probably have to veg out for a month.

Also guys can we keep it CIVIL.

[Extreme110]

This is a little bit spoilers, but still. Apparently one of the Writers of Mass Effect made a post on the Penny Arcade forums, in which he states that only the lead writer and Casey Hudson were involved in writing the end. We can't confirm that the post was indeed the writer, but it definitely was made on his account, and it definitely sounds like someone from the inside.

Spoiler

http://gamerant.com/bioware-mass-effect-3-ending-curt-139503/2/

[GovernorTarkin]

http://social.biowar...index/4434815/1

This guy is either a prophet or he works/worked for bioware. He "predicted" the "end" a year ago.

Edit: Also you should watch this video

[Kerk]

This is hillarious!

[zbyl2]

Amazon no longer sells Mass Effect 3 because "it is not as described". Check it out: http://www.amazon.co...33361640&sr=8-2
Sreenshot in case they start selling it again: http://img827.images...120402at154.png

Am I only one who finds it pretty hilarious? Though it is a bit of overreacting honestly, sure ending sucked but game as a whole wasn't all that bad...

[ZM90]

Although the single player is solid I hate how Bioware tied what ending you get to multiplayer. I want a solid single player experience I could care less about multiplayer and tying multiplayer to EMS was a horrible decision that screwed those who only want to play single player over. Here is Ghirahim to sum it all up.

[Kerk]

Latest news: Bioware is haggling. Now they are saying that they will make a free DLC that will "bring more closure." Well...at least we on the right track. But it shows 2 things:

1) This DLC is not going to be big, otherwise it wouldn't be free.
2) This is most certainly not going to be what we've been asking for. They are trying to minimize their loss as much as possible.

But the haggling isn't over. Not by a long shot.